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Author Topic: Mozart Violinkonzerte  (Read 763 times)
IgnorantRockFan
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« on: 16:46:30, 25-02-2007 »

I just bought this on ebay (I went a bit mad in the last couple of weeks and put in low bids on a lot of classical CDs that looked vaguely interesting -- winning a surprising number for under a pound or two each!)

I have an observation that perhaps other people will be able to explain for me.

First, it's a 2CD set issued in 2001 by... well, I'm not sure who by but I assume it's of German origin (the text is German first with an English translation afterwards). The violinist is Yehudi Menuhin and the set includes:

Violinkonzert D-Dur KV Anh. 294a "Adelaide" - Paris Symphony Orchestra, Pierre Monteux (1934)

Violinkonzert Nr. 3 G-Dur KV216 - Paris Symphony Orchestra, Georges Enesco (1935)

Violinkonzert Nr. 4 D-Dur KV218 - Liverpool Philharmonic, Malcolm Sargent (1943)

Violinkonzert Nr. 7 D-Dur KV271a - Paris Symphony Orchestra, Georges Enesco (1932)

The notes are very scanty and don't say anything about the "Adelaide" concerto. So here is my observation: it's not written by Mozart, is it?

I have this concerto on another CD (recorded 1990, disc issued in 2000) and the notes with that say:

Quote
At least three violin concertos have at one time or another had Mozart's name erroneously attached to them. The one known as the 'Adelaide' is so charmingly melodius and engaging that no less a figure than Yehudi Menuhin took it up and recorded it, while the composer Paul Hindemith even went so far as to write cadenzas for it (Vanessa-Mae uses her own on this recording). In the event, this delightful piece turns out to be the work of the violinist Marius Casadesus, one of a renowned family of musicians that produced a number of such 'old masters'. He initially presented it at a concert in Paris in 1931 as a hitherto unpublished work by Mozart, dedicated to Adelaide, daughter of Louis XV, which he had merely edited and orchestrated.

So, I'm wondering: when was the "fraud" discovered? The Menuhin recording is from 1934, three years after Casadesus's premier. Was it still believed to be Mozart's at that time?

(Another point, but perhaps unanswerable, is why the CD doesn't give a proper credit: it was issued in 2001, and it must have been known at that time as my 2000 disc correctly attributes it to Casadesus.)

I'm also intrigued by the numbering of the concerto. First, why doesn't it have a number? "Concerto No. 8", or whatever. Was it ever numbered in that way and then stripped of its number when the deception was discovered? Second, why does the KV-number end in an "a"? Does that signify "we know it's not Mozart really"? But then why give it a K-number at all? Thirdly, what does "Anh." mean, and why do none of the other concertos on the disc include it? Does that signify "we know it's not Mozart really"?

One final observation: the CD insert does have a short comment on KV 271a:

Quote
The Violin Concerto in D, K271a is not from Mozart in the form on had. The music was most probably written down in the first half of the 19th century, presumably with reference to notes made by Mozart. For example, one theme from the final movement bears a striking similarity to a theme from Mozart's ballet music "Les petits rien".

Ok, I note that this also has the "a" suffix but it doesn't include the word "Anh." And it does has a "proper" number (No.7), which seems to me to be a bit of a cheat!

Overall I'm perplexed.

("Stop obsessing over pointless trivia IRF and just enjoy the music.")

I know, I know, but I find these things interesting...  Embarrassed

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Allegro, ma non tanto
tonybob
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« Reply #1 on: 18:08:29, 25-02-2007 »

IRF,
It's a very interesting subject, innit?

you are quite right - it isn't by mozart.

the chaps here:

http://www.mozartforum.com/

who are far more intelligent than i could ever ever be, don't even include it in there current Koechel catalogue.

It may be worth visiting the forums and asking them.

nb - following quote from mozartforum:
Quote
When Einstein said that this is a "a piece of mystification a la Kreisler", I believe he was being generous. Kreisler's "forgeries" went on to be appreciated by musicians and their audiences. The "Adelaïde" concerto is a forgery, and my advice to you is as follows: Do not spend your time and money running after this. There is so much real, good Mozart that you can appreciate!
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sososo s & i.
John W
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« Reply #2 on: 18:22:53, 25-02-2007 »

IRF,

I quote/edit from author Arthur Hutchings:

Quote
Mozart often made short scores, arrangements of orchestral works on two staves from which he could give some account of on the piano. In 1933 Marius Cassadesus published a D major concerto transcribed from such a score, with the upper stave in D and lower one in E.

At the time of his book (1976) Hutchings reckoned no-one other than Cassadesus had seen the short score which Mozart allegedly had dedicated to Louis V's daughter Adelaide. There may have been further revelations about this since 1976 proving it's a forgery?

K numbers were originally assigned in Ludwig von Kochel's catalogue, in a near chronological order. Kochel died in 1877, so works discovered after Kochel were assigned an a, b etc suffix to relate then to other appropriate works or approximate chronology rather than add to K.622 ....

The Anh. is sometimes App. I expect means appendix and refers to works that are spurious, not known to be genuine Mozart compositions.

John W

« Last Edit: 18:33:58, 25-02-2007 by John W » Logged
IgnorantRockFan
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« Reply #3 on: 20:20:15, 25-02-2007 »

Very enlightening, thank you Smiley

The mozartforum quote come across as a bit "snobbish". Perhaps I'm being unfair, taking it out of context, but it seems to say that the concerto is unworthy simply because it's not by Mozart.

I actually quite like the 'Adelaide' on its own merits and if Mozart didn't compose it then I say it's his loss  Tongue

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oliver sudden
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« Reply #4 on: 21:42:29, 25-02-2007 »

I thought it was by Joyce Hatto.
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thompson1780
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« Reply #5 on: 23:15:18, 12-04-2007 »

For the Mozart VCs I like Grumiaux, but have heard a really good Oistrakh VC No.3

There you are - a penny's worth....

Tommo
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #6 on: 07:16:38, 13-04-2007 »

The Anh. is sometimes App. I expect means appendix and refers to works that are spurious, not known to be genuine Mozart compositions.
App. is just English for Anh. Or rather it's Latin for a Hanging-On Bit whereas the Germans have their own word Anhang, from their words for On and Hang. A trailer (in the sense of something you hang on the end of a car) is an Anhänger by the way.

Here is the Mozart forum's page on the Köchel catalogue. I wonder what happened to K.Anh.B ?

I like this bit too.

"Please feel free to contact any of the MozartForum owners with information or corrections you think should be in our Köchel Listings."

Cripes. I wouldn't dare. Although I can think of someone here who probably would.
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time_is_now
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« Reply #7 on: 15:44:32, 13-04-2007 »

App. is just English for Anh. Or rather it's Latin for a Hanging-On Bit whereas the Germans have their own word Anhang, from their words for On and Hang. A trailer (in the sense of something you hang on the end of a car) is an Anhänger by the way.

What's a 'hanger-on'?

(I'm not testing you, I have no idea myself actually.)
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #8 on: 16:08:25, 13-04-2007 »

App. is just English for Anh. Or rather it's Latin for a Hanging-On Bit whereas the Germans have their own word Anhang, from their words for On and Hang. A trailer (in the sense of something you hang on the end of a car) is an Anhänger by the way.

What's a 'hanger-on'?

(I'm not testing you, I have no idea myself actually.)

The parliamentary ranks of Blair supporters might provide a fruitful source of data from which to derive a definition? Wink
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
thompson1780
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« Reply #9 on: 22:41:20, 17-07-2007 »

IRF

Forgot to say that Cassadesus wrote the 'Handel Viola Concerto' too.  It's actually pretty good, so if you like his Mozart, try his Handel.

Tommo
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #10 on: 23:16:25, 17-07-2007 »

App. is just English for Anh. Or rather it's Latin for a Hanging-On Bit whereas the Germans have their own word Anhang, from their words for On and Hang. A trailer (in the sense of something you hang on the end of a car) is an Anhänger by the way.

What's a 'hanger-on'?

(I'm not testing you, I have no idea myself actually.)

Wouldn't pretend to know exactly but here's a discussion:

http://dict.leo.org/forum/viewUnsolvedquery.php?idThread=266252&idForum=2&lp=ende&lang=de

You'll note someone asks the question: "War sie anhänglich?"
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