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Author Topic: Schubert's symphonies and career, and myths about the composer  (Read 1006 times)
Ian Pace
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« Reply #15 on: 17:06:32, 26-03-2007 »

wasn't it a bit more than an 'intimation' of mortality in Schubert's case? It's ages since I've read them but isn't it possible to read some of his letters as hinting that he knew pretty well what was coming?
He certainly did. Rather famous letter to Leopold Kupelweiser, 1824:

In a word, I feel myself the most unhappy and wretched creature in the world.  Imagine a man whose health will never be right again, and who in sheer despair over this ever makes things worse and worse, instead of better; imagine a man, I say, whose most brilliant hopes have perished, to whom the happiness of love and friendship have nothing to offer but pain, at best, whose enthusiasm (at least of the stimulating kind) for all things beautiful threatens to disappear, and I ask you, is he not a miserable unhappy being?—“My peace is gone, my heart is sore, I shall find it never and nevermore”. I may well sing every day now, for each night, I go to bed hoping never to wake again, and each morning only tells me of yesterday’s grief.

I see a reasonably clear reflection of that in the music but not in the sense of it somehow demanding slow tempi (is that how people looking at death in the face see the world anyway? I wouldn't know but I can see a firm case for the opposite). To me it's in the pieces like the late piano sonatas and the last symphony that don't want to end. Or in Winterreise: I'm not personally convinced by performances which milk Der Leiermann for all it's worth; for my money he wrote all the pathos out of it. I remember many years ago singing it through with a pianist and being (wet behind the ears as I was) startled by the fast tempo he took for the opening. But rather than do the old singer thing of imposing my own tempo I gave it a go and we continued in a moderate and absolutely fixed tempo. Which has been how I've seen it ever since: there's no rhetoric in the music as far as I'm concerned, any more than there is in the playing of the kind of street musician who's the Leiermann's archetype.

Couldn't agree more with all that. If the 'heart on sleeve' expressivity comes anywhere, it's surely in Die Nebensonnen, after which Der Leiermann is some type of bleak, hopeless, numb epilogue (to my mind its sense of emptiness is slightly foreshadowed by the silences in Im Dorfe). The situation is even more complex in Die schöne Müllerin, where I hear an emotional (in the sense of explicitly emotional) apotheosis in Tränenregen and then, cruelly, in Mein!. Then a long disintegration towards the nirvana through death in Des Baches Wiegenlied. Actually, I find, in a psychological sense, Winterreise to be more straightforward in some ways, because it plays much less with the presentation genuine innocence (even in Die Post, which comes the closest), which continually re-emerges then is dashed in Müllerin. In Winterreise I hear a clear sense of self-foreboding and awareness from the outset, which rarely diminishes; in this sense it is less obviously a tragedy (which Müllerin certainly is) as a meditation from the perspective of suffering.
« Last Edit: 17:37:43, 26-03-2007 by Ian Pace » Logged

'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Ian Pace
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« Reply #16 on: 17:26:31, 26-03-2007 »

there's no rhetoric in the music [Der Leiermann] as far as I'm concerned, any more than there is in the playing of the kind of street musician who's the Leiermann's archetype.

Assuming one admits to some degree of mimetic realism in the song (which I think is a fair assumption), the very mechanical and immutable qualities of the barrel organ itself surely imply something other than a rhetorical treatment. I think of the beginning of D960 in a similar way (in contradistinction to when the same melody appears in a single voice in G-flat soon afterwards), but that's another story....
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
oliver sudden
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« Reply #17 on: 17:43:25, 26-03-2007 »

There's been a certain amount of discussion over the years as to whether he's playing a barrel-organ or a hurdy-gurdy. The fact that Schubert's music sounds not at all like mechanical fairground tunes and an awful lot like a single line being picked out over a drone makes it pretty clear to me that it's a hurdy-gurdy though.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #18 on: 18:13:17, 26-03-2007 »

Here is the beginning of the autograph of Der Leiermann



(from http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/nettheim/simile.htm , which looks at whether the grace-note in the bass should be continued after the first bars)

Here are 17th-century paintings of Der Leiermann (by Jacques Bellange (1614) and Jacques Callot (1622), respectively)



(obviously a long long time before Schubert, but which show the association of such a figure with such an instrument did exist)

Here is a modern hurdy-gurdy:



I think you are probably right about the instrument - correct my association with a barrel organ above. That does rather modify my position on rhetoric, when the instrument is less mechanised. However, I reckon the drone should be pretty steady and unyielding.

(full music for Der Leiermann to follow! Illustrations make these threads nicer to read, don't you think?)
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Ian Pace
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« Reply #19 on: 18:34:12, 26-03-2007 »

Here is the complete song:

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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
smittims
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« Reply #20 on: 10:39:07, 02-04-2007 »

Schubert's early death obscures the fact that he was only a few years older than Wagner. If he had had the career of Verdi or vaughan Williams he could have heard the 'Ring'. And what music might he have been writing in the 1860's? I think the harmonies in his 1828 works are a clue that he might have been a more progresive composer in the sense of presaging 20th century developments.

But one can never know,and I'm content with what he did do.Schubert is a composer I can never hear too much of. 
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SimonSagt!
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« Reply #21 on: 13:52:59, 02-04-2007 »

I agree with you 100% smittims. I feel rather the same about Mendelssohn as well as Schubert. Such melody crammed into relatively short spans.

As to what he might have written - as you say, we'll never know. But of one thing I am certain: it would have been beautiful music.

bws S-S!
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SimonSagt!
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« Reply #22 on: 10:44:16, 03-04-2007 »

Me and you agreeing, smittims, seems to be one sure way of stopping a thread dead in its tracks!  Grin
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The Emperor suspected they were right. But he dared not stop and so on he walked, more proudly than ever. And his courtiers behind him held high the train... that wasn't there at all.
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