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Author Topic: The Minotaur  (Read 5977 times)
richard barrett
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« Reply #30 on: 13:09:58, 06-03-2008 »

it cuts both ways.
Quite so: the fault is with the tax system in this country as well as the cultural funding policy.

Of course I agree that everyone ought to be paid properly for what they do. But the situation we're talking about here is one reason why I have no wish ever to be professionally involved with opera houses. (Not that they'd ask me anyway, of course, just in case anyone thought I had delusions of that particular kind of grandeur.)
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #31 on: 13:21:55, 06-03-2008 »

And there will also be many people who could afford it, but would be worried about taking a punt on what is essentially an unknown quantity: I took my sister to the new Scottish Opera projects last week (tickets £15, absolute bargain) and she said she would have been put off by the ticket prices because she really had no way of guessing whether she would enjoy it or not

That's an extremely valid point.  I think part of the success of the ENO "powerhouse" era was that the marketing "push" was on ENO as the funkiest place to see anything in the arts, and that anything you might go to there would be a sure-fire success AND you'd be sitting amongst celebs and musos in the audience too.  The CBSO with Rattle in Birmingham achieved the same thing.

On the other hand Tatiana Kuinji (probably the top colaratura soprano working in Russia right now, since Netrebko left anyhow) told me she was just back from a concert in Rostov-On-Don.  Apparently people complained that the seats cost 100 rubles (£2) instead of the usual 50 roubles (£1).  And actually Rostov isn't a poor or backward place, either  Shocked
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #32 on: 13:23:57, 06-03-2008 »

one reason why I have no wish ever to be professionally involved with opera houses.

You mean you want to be involved unprofessionallyRoll Eyes   There's a waiting-list, matey, Lord Byron's been waiting longer than you have  Wink
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
richard barrett
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« Reply #33 on: 13:43:25, 06-03-2008 »

You mean you want to be involved unprofessionally
I suppose that's my only choice. It's OK, I'll let Byron go first.
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #34 on: 18:39:21, 06-03-2008 »

Try hanging around Stage Doors Wink

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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
time_is_now
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« Reply #35 on: 19:18:10, 06-03-2008 »

It would be nice if the Arts Council paid for it all properly

Well, up to a point it would be nice, but it cuts both ways.

As it is, at least a part of the cost of my ticket for The Minotaur is being subsidised by people who probably earn less than I do. And they don't get to hear it while I do. It's asking quite a lot of such people to subsidise my ticket even more than they do already. Undecided
That's a very good point, and incisively made, George. Thank you for reminding us.

I do think £65 is a ridiculous amount to have to pay to see an opera, not in terms of how much the artists need to be paid (although I can pretty much guarantee you Birtwistle is being paid well enough for his trouble, Reiner, since that's the one part of the process on which I don't feel the need to bow to your superior knowledge) but in terms of the idea of hoping the widest possible audience would be willing to take a chance on going to see such a thing. But that's not even really to do with the tax system or the cultural funding set-up in Britain, as far as I can see: it's to do with the eternal problem raised by people needing to make a living and/or spend part of their living on an activity which is designated as 'leisure' but is in fact, of course, an evolved form of the fundamental human compulsion to give expression to ideas and feelings. I don't see how you're going to square that circle unless and until we manage to abolish money and private property, so in the meantime we're always going to be living with a paradoxical situation to which there are no ideal solutions.
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #36 on: 19:51:38, 06-03-2008 »

but in terms of the idea of hoping the widest possible audience would be willing to take a chance on going to see such a thing. But that's not even really to do with the tax system or the cultural funding set-up in Britain, as far as I can see: it's to do with the eternal problem raised by people needing to make a living and/or spend part of their living on an activity which is designated as 'leisure' but is in fact, of course, an evolved form of the fundamental human compulsion to give expression to ideas and feelings.

They will spring £65 for THE WOMAN IN WHITE, or WICKED, or JOSEPH, or GONE WITH THE WIND.  In fact "Wicked" and "Gone With The Wind" are top-price above £90 face-value without agent fees.

The money isn't the problem.
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
opilec
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« Reply #37 on: 23:46:25, 06-03-2008 »

I notice ENO's Punch and Judy is on some of the same nights as The Minotaur.

Yes, but only some. And the ROH's Linbury studio is putting it on in March. You wait ages for a production, and then two come along at once ...

Concerning the hoo-ha about £65 seats for The Minotaur, this is only the top price. The full price range is: £5, £10, £20, £30, £35, £40, £50, £65. Hardly exorbitant - after all, it's not a local church hall production. And these prices compare very favourably with the ROH's more usual ones.
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operacat
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« Reply #38 on: 12:43:23, 17-03-2008 »

I am going on 19th.
I am also going to the Insight Evening on 3rd April - the day after I come back from Italy!!

I am really looking forward to this - composed by Harrison Birtwistle, sung by John Tomlinson, conducted by Antonio Pappano....what could be better??!!!
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operacat
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« Reply #39 on: 12:51:12, 17-03-2008 »

Sorry, but £65 is peanuts.

Not if you don't have it.

Exactly! I agree in principle with everything Reiner Torheit says, we ARE getting value for money - but the fact remains that, for those of us on low incomes, opera is more or less out of reach most of the time.
No doubt the powers that be would argue that people on CHAV incomes 'ought not to' love the arts anyway, it's above their heads.....
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operacat
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« Reply #40 on: 12:54:27, 17-03-2008 »

You are right, Reiner, it is worth it - everyone deserves to be paid, and I'm pretty sure it will be a memorable evening for which I will begrudge not a single penny. .....
A well-known arts chief pointed out to me, regarding Edinburgh Festival opera prices, that if people expected to be able to see an opera for the same price as a cinema ticket, they had another ****ing thing coming, because they couldn't do it!

Furthermore, the Edinburgh Festival prices are well within even my price range!!
Although 'price of a cinema ticket' is a long-running argument with my partner, i.e. he says, if I didn't go to the opera so often, he'd be afford to go to the pictures more....whereas I say that if he didn't go to the pictures so often, I'd be afford to go to the opera more!!! Grin
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...trj...
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« Reply #41 on: 13:12:19, 17-03-2008 »

Going to be there on April 30th.

My first Birtwistle opera  Shocked
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #42 on: 21:41:42, 17-03-2008 »

Anyone want to know about the only Birtwhistle opera I have seen?  The First Mrs Kong.  We only went because it was the only work at Glyndebourne where we could get seats for love or money.  The perfect auditorium was noticeably less full in Act 2.
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #43 on: 21:49:27, 17-03-2008 »

I've never been to a Birtwistle opera either, but am looking forward to The Minotaur. I do have a CD recording of Gawain, which I wished I had seen, but it was very early in my opera-going days and I was 'playing safe' with the repertory!
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martle
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« Reply #44 on: 21:58:42, 17-03-2008 »

DB, you mean The SECOND Mrs Kong (a fairly crucial distinction given the subject matter!)? Anyway, that was one of three (the others being Gawain and P+J) that I've seen live. On each occasion I knew I was seeing something that moved the genre on a nudge or two. For that reason, I'll bribe, blackmail and possibly dismember to get into the Minotaur. I don't think you get a truly innovative and artistically gold-plated composer like HB coming along very often to contribute to musical theatre, and he fits that bill, IMO.
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