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Author Topic: Britten concert, Cadogan Hall, Saturday afternoon  (Read 1436 times)
Mary Chambers
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« Reply #30 on: 18:04:17, 02-09-2007 »

Is it particularly the baritone voice you find "wrong" for transposed Britten cycles... or the idea of transposition per se?  Songs by other composers frequently (one might even say "normally") appeared in both keys...  for example, you can find both baritones and tenors singing Winterreise etc.  I've heard extremely credible performances of "Winter Words" and "The Poet's Echo" by mezzo-sopranos,  for example. 

I'm more curious and intrigued by your feelings on this than antagonistic here, btw Wink   Is transposition a worse crime than, say... orchestrating the Cabaret Songs?  Wink

I'm probably just prejudiced, I'm afraid. I'm not very keen on baritones singing the Schubert cycles either, let alone mezzos/sopranos (though I do own a CD, bought out of curiosity, of a boy treble singing Die Schone Mullerin - sorry, no umlauts) - in fact I'm not all that keen on baritones in general, though they do vary very much and I do admire Keenlyside.  The idea of transposition does worry me to some degree in itself, too. Keys have individual characters, I feel. It's the iconic orchestral cycles, Serenade for Tenor, Horn and Strings and Nocturne, that I feel really strongly about, so I was relieved to realise that what Ron says is true - it would be impossible in some cases. I fully understand people wanting to sing them - I've certainly had a go in the privacy of my own home, and Heather Harper said when she was a teenager she sang the Serenade "in unison with Peter" on the record. That might have been worth hearing!

I just can't imagine Winter Words sung by a mezzo - must think about that. My copy just says "For high voice". Britten was keen on getting his work performed, generally - as I'm sure you know. he allows for a mezzo to sing Oberon.
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #31 on: 18:15:16, 02-09-2007 »

Quote
My copy just says "For high voice"

Mezzos are higher than tenors

But I agree, it's also about "character" of voice... there are mezzos like Bartoli who are bright and sparkling... and there are others who were born to play the "old bag" parts :-)

What do you think about mezzos doing Poet's Echo - particularly Russian mezzos, who are keen for a crack at something in their native language? Smiley
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
Mary Chambers
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« Reply #32 on: 18:29:44, 02-09-2007 »

What do you think about mezzos doing Poet's Echo - particularly Russian mezzos, who are keen for a crack at something in their native language? Smiley

I don't feel strongly about that one, for some reason, probably because it doesn't have the "iconic status" for me, and I don't speak Russian - I think the Russian mezzos should probably have their chance, so long as the sopranos do it too.

I wonder if sopranos should do "A Charm of Lullabies"?
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #33 on: 18:35:02, 02-09-2007 »

Keys have individual characters, I feel.
Keys haven't really had as much individual character as they used to, though, since equal temperament became pretty much universal - which by the way was the mid-to-late nineteenth century, so in any case even performing Schubert in equal temperament changes the 'character' of the music as much as a small transposition would...

OK, here come two of Ollie's Transposition Bugbears.

Mahler Wunderhorn-Lieder: some of these are nearly always transposed and they're orchestral songs so you sometimes have lines going out of the range of instruments. Revelge is almost invariably transposed - Mahler wrote it in D minor for a tenor, not C or even Bb minor for a baritone. Alas the only tenor recording I know is with Gösta Winbergh not long before his death and in very unconvincing voice - and on a recording where lots of the other songs are also transposed. Why they couldn't have done it properly I don't know. And yes, Herreweghe's recent recording on period instruments has lots of songs transposed. What's the point of going to the effort of finding the right orchestral sonority if you're then going to change it by transposing things?

Schumann op.35 Kerner cycle. Schumann went to great lengths between Stille Thränen and Wer machte dich so krank? to get a transition between the C major of the former and the Ab major of the latter: one ends in C major, the other starts with a G major chord before moving to Eb7 and then Ab major. Anyone out there have a recording where the two songs are at least transposed by the same amount? Neither do I. I do however have a couple of recordings where Stille Thränen is transposed down to Ab major and Wer machte dich so krank? is left in Ab. So we get a crunching gear change precisely because Schumann wanted a smooth transition. I've only heard those songs juxtaposed in the written keys once, and I'm afraid the singer was dreadful, but that's because, er, it was me...  Undecided
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #34 on: 18:38:32, 02-09-2007 »

Good evening, Rei.

Sorry I'm fading in and out like the Cheshire Cat; I'm doing some audio editing at the moment, and can only flick across from time to time whilst rendering.

It isn't as much the range per se for singers as the fach i.e. where the vocal line predominantly lies within that given range, and how much of it is physically awkward for the particular singer: what was comfortable for Pears has created problems for many tenors since for this very reason, it's just plain uncomfortable for them. They can sing higher, and/or lower but find that what fitted his vocal chords like a glove ends up either flapping around theirs like a pillow case or else is too tight to get into properly. The 'break' in his voice (a technical term for the point at which the chest and head voices, the two constituent registers of all human vocal production meet, and thus the most difficult and troublesome place in the whole vocal range for any singer*) seems to have been in an unusual place for a tenor voice: lower, towards where a Baritone's might be.

*Apologies for this very simplified description
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #35 on: 18:41:14, 02-09-2007 »

Ah, since the texts of Poet's Echo are by Pushkin, they don't just have "iconic" status in Russia...  they are regarded as practically handed-down from on high on stone tablets Smiley   So many are interested in singing them here Smiley

Where was Pears's break, Ron?  For tenors it usually occurs in the d-f region,  for baritones about a minor third lower. 
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
Ron Dough
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« Reply #36 on: 21:06:41, 02-09-2007 »

I don't know exactly, but I'm happy to hazard a guess that it was at least a tone lower than most other tenors. So far as I know, Britten never wrote anything above a B?for him - and then only at crucial moments ("And God have mercy upon me" in Act 2, sc. i of Grimes, the first note of the climactic second "straight as lust" during The Ride to Rome in Lucretia). (I'm having to rely on memory here, the scores are not to hand.) Similarly, the lowest note I'm aware of written for him is the cheeky bottom C at the end of the Spring Symphony ("And so, my friends, I cease.") which is admittedly a little weak, but certainly more than a growl on the two recordings Pears made. All of this starts to suggest a low-ish tenor voice, but I'm also aware from personal experience that apart from the high notes big stretches of Britten's writing for him sit comfortably within a baritone's range: much more so than, for example, the music that Tippett writes for tenors: it's all this which leads me to this break conclusion. Britten's writing for baritone I always found more uncomfortable, for some reason: Billy and the baritone parts written for D F-D (War Requiem, Cantata Misericordium, Songs and Proverbs of William Blake) actually seem to lie higher in their own range for longer periods than do the parts written for Pears. Britten's writing for basses is pretty cruel, too. Swallow, right at the beginning of Grimes, is an absolute pig to sing, exploiting the extremes of the range and demanding great agility from the word go (lengthy warm-up essential). Claggarts need hugely strong bottom registers, as do Danskers and Quinces: vocal casting for Britten operas must be an extremely demanding task.
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Mary Chambers
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« Reply #37 on: 21:26:45, 02-09-2007 »

The part of Billy is said to have been conceived at first for Geraint Evans, but he withdrew because he felt the tessitura was too high for him. (He did sing some other part - Ned Keene?).

Pears's voice did have some baritone elements, and the break was unusually placed as far as I can tell, but he was very famous for his Bach Evangelists, which I think have quite a high tessitura?
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #38 on: 21:48:27, 02-09-2007 »

Yes, Mary, Evans is Keene on the Britten Grimes recording, was to have been Balstrode on the first Davis recording, but was too unwell, and sung Mr Flint at the premiere of Budd. He was also an exponent of the role of Bottom in MND, of course, celebrated amongst other things for an apoplectic complaint in his broad Welsh accent to Sir David Webster after a well-known British counter-tenor had altered the words to "I know a bank" in rehearsals, "These... 'omosexuals is b*ggering about with Shakespeare....and....Britten!" A comment at least doubly ironic....
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #39 on: 22:00:10, 02-09-2007 »

Pears's range - also from memory, there are a couple of high B naturals: for example 'be so good as to leave me' to Claggart in Billy Budd (an ossia was printed, but he sings the B on the recording) and 'a whitened doorstep' in the hut scene in Grimes. There's also a high B in the Michelangelo songs, if memory serves.

He has a couple of low Bbs here and there; at the end of two of the 'excellently bright's in the Serenade, for example, and at the end of the Owen setting in the Nocturne (although there it's an A#).

Billy is deliberately a very high baritone - casting in that opera is very tricky if the dramatic strengths of the singers are to line up with their ranges. I've seen a Billy with a heavier voice than the Claggart, which is not a great idea.
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #40 on: 22:07:55, 02-09-2007 »

Oh, and what's the last "Go there!" at the start of Grimes Act 2 ii? That's pretty low, too; it's very hard for any singer to make the right dramatic emphasis down there, especially after the long melisma before it (and is the second note of that another Bb?)
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #41 on: 22:08:27, 02-09-2007 »

Although I've once or twice been found treading the boards, I prefer to have others do it for me... Smiley  I that context in auditions one of the things we're looking for is seamlessly joined registers, and thus what happens around the break.  Poor intonation in the break area is the usual tell-tale sign...   is anyone familiar with Pears's performances in detail, listening for wonky intonation or wide (or perhaps I ought to say wider-than-usual) oscilating vibrato in particular areas of the voice?

I think this "Pears legacy" thing (which was mentioned in another thread re Britten/Verdi etc) has eventually got to shuffle off and die.  Many people admire the Vickers performance of Grimes... but it wasn't at all like Pears.  But Vickers would have been like a bull in a china shop in the Serenade... also a Pears work.  Similarly there are extremely light "English" tenors (who would be classed "tenorino" where I am  Wink ) who might sing some Britten well... and be struggling to be heard in other works.  We don't insist on this kind of thing in the works of other composers...  "that's a Viardot role, so this other girl can't do it"...    Shouldn't our expectations be result-driven, rather than having Pears as the eternal benchmark?   The Serenade performances I mentioned above we did in Russia were given by a tenor who also sings Tristan, Grimes and Radames...  they were a complete success on their own times (and the audience were pinned to their seats with "every night and all!" like something out of a Tom'n'Jerry cartoon Smiley )
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
oliver sudden
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« Reply #42 on: 22:12:08, 02-09-2007 »

Oh, and what's the last "Go there!" at the start of Grimes Act 2 ii? That's pretty low, too; it's very hard for any singer to make the right dramatic emphasis down there, especially after the long melisma before it (and is the second note of that another Bb?)
Ron, I'll need the score for that one -

...the 'go there's cover from top Bb to bottom C in all.
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #43 on: 22:23:09, 02-09-2007 »

Shouldn't our expectations be result-driven, rather than having Pears as the eternal benchmark?

One of the things about Pears for me is precisely that ability to cover the changes in register, which is something rather rarer in a big voice. For some reason the E above middle C seems to have been a favourite note for Pears; for most tenors that is indeed going to be smack in the middle of the passaggio (or rather between the primo passaggio and the secondo passaggio, depending what school you went to Wink ). The Great Bear and Pleiades monologue in Grimes makes a big feature of that note and you can really hear Vickers working there! - but to my ear the result is still musically and dramatically valid.
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #44 on: 22:58:21, 02-09-2007 »

Rei,

The only reason I brought the subject of Pears up on this thread was to open out thoughts on transposition. Even in his own lifetime there were singers who were able to his roles their own: Richard Lewis, a Covent Garden stalwart, creator of Tippett's Mark and Achilles, as well as Walton's Troilus (and Glyndebourne's first Poppea Nero to boot) was wonderful as Vere. Had Kenneth MacDonald not died so early, I'm sure he would have been a major successor to Pears (it was he, not Tear, who covered and alternated for Pears in Burning Fiery Furnace, and again he rather than Tear who was given Pears's original role of Flute, when the later moved across to play Lysander as one of what must have been the oldest quartets of lovers on records in the Decca set).

Whilst it's true that there have been very few singers who can tackle the full range of Pears's repertoire convincingly, it's only fair to point out that they and others may well venture into other areas of the tenor domain that Pears wouldn't (or couldn't) consider. Singing actors are as bound by their psyche and physicality as other actors, they just have the added super-selection of having to possess exactly the right voice as well. So yes, Vickers as Albert or Quint, let alone Flute would have been a no-no (and he'd almost certainly never have considered Aschenbach Wink). Graham Clark is great for Quint and Vere but possibly too small to make a convincing Peter. Philip Langridge seems to have been able to work through most of the canon successfully, and there are plenty more tenors of the last three decades who can certainly make some of Pears's parts their own. For me the problem lies more with whether they can emulate rather than replicate his astonishing ability to colour words and phrases (or even, in Andrew Kennedy's case, sing the words at all without mangling the vowel sounds to the point where one wonders whether he actually can be singing in his mother tongue - Peter Schreier did at least have that excuse.) 
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