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Author Topic: A Little About Riegger and More On Feldman  (Read 1132 times)
Bryn
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« Reply #15 on: 01:43:37, 14-12-2007 »

For a few years, in my youth, I thought I knew and admired a work for piano and wind quintet by this Wallingford Riegger. It was on a Saga LP, along with Barber's "Summer Music" and other works for chamber winds by American composers. I eventually discovered that the attribution on the record label and sleeve was erroneous. I seem to recall it was actually the Poulenc sextet for piano and winds. Wink

Clips from the real thing, (the Concerto for Piano and Wind Quintet by Riegger, that is) can be heard here.
« Last Edit: 01:51:46, 14-12-2007 by Bryn » Logged
roslynmuse
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« Reply #16 on: 08:26:52, 14-12-2007 »

Ah, Saga! One of Mr Barrington-Coupe's involvements, I seem to recall. So mis-attribution not a surprise...
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autoharp
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« Reply #17 on: 08:43:45, 14-12-2007 »

Stylistically, there is a lot in common with Ruth Crawford Seeger and Carl Ruggles as well. Do those names ring a larger, more sonorous bell for anyone?

But beyond the "dissonant counterpoint", quite a bit of difference between Crawford and Ruggles. And Crawford and Riegger were both firmly on the political left and Ruggles, er . . . was not.

I've never heard any Riegger, outside of a brief chamber duo. Always wanted to hear Study in sonority. Did his politics influence his music in any way?

[A pedant writes: Ruth Crawford never used the "Seeger" addition to her name. Only people who wrote about her. We shouldn't either].



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Sydney Grew
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« Reply #18 on: 09:21:55, 14-12-2007 »

Crawford and Riegger were both firmly on the political left and Ruggles, er . . . was not.

Yes all those agit-prop workers' songs he wrote and published under pseudonyms constitute one difference between Riegger and Brahms. They are also very likely to be the reason why so little of his work is performed and recorded to this day - given the character of his native land.
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increpatio
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« Reply #19 on: 14:58:29, 14-12-2007 »

. [moved]
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #20 on: 15:08:42, 14-12-2007 »

Yes, inko: the politics and art section of this thread has taken on a life of its own, and we've been asked to split it: this will allow posts relevant to Mr Grew's thread to relate to each other more easily. (I'll move anything back that's needed.)
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richard barrett
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« Reply #21 on: 15:14:19, 14-12-2007 »

So far, then, there's been a little about Riegger, virtually nothing about Feldman and a great deal of pointless bickering about... oh, it's gone.

So, Feldman. We're approaching a time when pretty much everything he wrote will have been recorded, several works in multiple versions which make clear quite a wide range of interpretative possibility in his work (I principally mean the fully-notated work). Somewhere in the distant past, an example was posted of one of Feldman's early "graph" scores, with a comment along the lines of it being somewhat defective as a musical composition.

A couple of further observations therefore:

Feldman may have thought so himself, to some extent, in so far as at a certain point he abandoned such notational practices never to return to them. One reason could be that performers couldn't be relied upon to realise the music in the way he imagined it just on the basis of the unspecific notations, for example it must often have happened that accidentally "inappropriate" harmonic combinations would have occurred (ie. drawing attention to themselves in opposition to the general sense of continuity in the music), so that what he later wrote would to an extent have functioned as a "written-out" version of the earlier work.

The next stage came in the late 1970s when the durations of the works became much more extended. At this point (am I wrong?) more people began to sit up and take notice, at least in Europe, or at the very least I did, and the music was more often and more widely performed. Why was this? One would normally expect wider acceptance to follow upon a move towards greater "accessibility" rather than the opposite. Or would one?
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #22 on: 15:25:28, 14-12-2007 »

Here's a post from Bryn which belongs back here:

For a few years, in my youth, I thought I knew and admired a work for piano and wind quintet by this Wallingford Riegger. It was on a Saga LP, along with Barber's "Summer Music" and other works for chamber winds by American composers. I eventually discovered that the attribution on the record label and sleeve was erroneous. I seem to recall it was actually the Poulenc sextet for piano and winds. Wink

Ah, here is the source of the other recordings on that Saga LP:

The damned image would not link, so here's the URL of the page it belongs to.

I wonder if, in the distant past, the New York WInd Quinted just happened to record an LP of the Riegger and Poulenc works for piano and wind quintet? That might at least offer some sort of expalnation for the error of attribution on that Saga LP.

Update:


« Last Edit: 15:28:47, 14-12-2007 by Ron Dough » Logged
ahinton
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« Reply #23 on: 15:38:54, 14-12-2007 »

So far, then, there's been a little about Riegger, virtually nothing about Feldman and a great deal of pointless bickering about
I wouldn't say that is was all pointless, or even all bickering, actually, although I do agree that it was not noticeably short of recycled material; your own contributions certainly had a point - several of them, actually...

Anyway - the topic!...

Best,

Alistair
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Bryn
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« Reply #24 on: 15:43:45, 14-12-2007 »

Thanks Ron,

I will just add that it looks like the old LP recording might have been recycled on this CD. The performers appear to be the same, though they may, of course, have re-recorded it. The other items look interesting. Out of stock at Amazon UK itself, but there seem to be a few new, and used, copies available at fairly standard prices.
« Last Edit: 16:06:37, 14-12-2007 by Bryn » Logged
Ron Dough
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« Reply #25 on: 15:53:07, 14-12-2007 »

This is presumably a more recent recording, though it appears to be a transcription;

Riegger, Wind Quintet. Cowell, Quartet Romantic; 7 Paragraphs for String Trio. Ruth Crawford Seeger, Suite No.II for Piano & String Quartet. Lou Harrison, String Trio. Becker, The Abongo (New Jersey Percussion Ensemble)
Add to cart | Price: $ 5.99 | Country: AMERICA | D/A code: Analogue | Code: 80285-2 | BRO Code: 62288 | Label: NEW WORLD
Genre: Chamber Music


(In Berkshire Record Outlet's catalogue, but Berkshire, Mass, not your Berkshire, Bryn!)(You'll need to Google your way in because of the way their cookies work.)
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C Dish
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« Reply #26 on: 15:55:38, 14-12-2007 »

iTunes has 4 albums of Riegger in its catalogue. They must also be commercially available, no?

Perhaps not in the UK? If so, I'd be glad to act as an intermediary for anyone who wants the stuff.
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inert fig here
Bryn
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« Reply #27 on: 16:05:54, 14-12-2007 »

This is presumably a more recent recording, though it appears to be a transcription;

Riegger, Wind Quintet. Cowell, Quartet Romantic; 7 Paragraphs for String Trio. Ruth Crawford Seeger, Suite No.II for Piano & String Quartet. Lou Harrison, String Trio. Becker, The Abongo (New Jersey Percussion Ensemble)

Ordered that one via Amazon UK Market Place this afternoon, Ron. With the shipping costs involved in ordering from Berkshire Records, I probably got a better deal for my £6.01 including p&p.

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pim_derks
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« Reply #28 on: 21:43:29, 29-12-2007 »

What a pity it is that we have heard none of his works.

The following link came by in a discussion on Ralph Vaughan Williams at "the other place":

 http://www.calarecords.com/product/stokowski-conducts-51.cfm

There's only a snippet of the New Dance Op. 18b to be found on this page, but at least Mr Grew can hear a few seconds from a work by Riegger.
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
Sydney Grew
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« Reply #29 on: 23:43:32, 29-12-2007 »

Thank you Mr. Derks - that's nice. We have never heard pizzicato horns before! It is rather a pleasant effect. But towards the end of the excerpt it all becomes a little brash does it not?
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