The Radio 3 Boards Forum from myforum365.com
07:54:55, 02-12-2008 *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Whilst we happily welcome all genuine applications to our forum, there may be times when we need to suspend registration temporarily, for example when suffering attacks of spam.
 If you want to join us but find that the temporary suspension has been activated, please try again later.
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  

Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
Author Topic: BBCSO New (or Newish) Works  (Read 742 times)
George Garnett
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 3855



« on: 15:44:36, 08-04-2007 »

I'm not sure if I am performing a useful public service by doing this or not but since I have just been sent the BBCSO's new forward programme I thought I would flag up what they are doing in terms of premieres or UK premieres over the coming year or so (not including whatever is planned for the Proms).

2007

4 May           Giya Kancheli   Noch einen Schritt

12 May          Julian Anderson   Symphony

23 May          Alasdair Nicolson    The Broken Symphony (Endless Laments: Ghost Dances)

19 June         John Tavener   The Beautiful Names

5 October      Jorg Widmann    ad absurdum   

26 October     Colin Matthews    Reflected Images

2008

19 January     Judith Weir    New Work for BBC Symphony Chorus (as part of Composer Weekend)

15 February    Giya Kancheli   Concerto for Violin and Oboe

28 February    Krzystof Penderecki   Symphony No 8, 'Lieder der Verganglichkeit'

19 March       Kaija Saariaho    New Work

8 April           Aaron Jay Kernis    Newly Drawn Sky

18 April         Brett Dean   Clarinet Concerto: Ariel's Music

24 April         Kaija Saariaho    Adriana Mater (Concert Staging)

9 May           Dominic Muldowney  Tsunami


Any views? Must hears? Must misses?
« Last Edit: 15:53:31, 08-04-2007 by George Garnett » Logged
time_is_now
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4653



« Reply #1 on: 16:40:56, 08-04-2007 »


Any views? Must hears? Must misses?

Oh, that's really throwing down the gauntlet, isn't it! Wink Well, if I may make so bold:

Julian Anderson's Symphony (which strictly speaking doesn't fall into your category, being only a London premiere) is a must-hear. In fact, it's more of a must-hear-twice (-or-several-times), being the sort of piece that can seem on a first hearing to be more about dazzling technique and orchestration than anything deeper and slower to surface, but is in fact a taut and extremely subtle marriage of what you might think of as the 'legacy of Sibelius' with Anderson's rather more personal interest in developing a functional harmonic language that includes non-tempered pitches, and a way of making these actually 'work' on a big 19th/20th-century orchestra. The subtlety is of the sort that, in my experience at least, completely passes you by the first time round but becomes very clearly, and satisfyingly, audible by about the third or fourth hearing. If you are going, George, or anyone else - and in fact even if you're not going - I'd enthusiastically recommend having a go at the following in advance:

http://www.mdt.co.uk/MDTSite/product//NMCD121.htm

Symphony (we're supposed to italicise the title because Anderson insists he's not going to write a second) is by some measure the least well-played work on that disc, and the fact it's a live recording doesn't really do the extremely quiet opening any favours, but it'll give you an idea. And the, erm, unusually extensive programme notes provide a lot more analytical information, on Symphony in particular, than one often finds in a CD booklet.

Alasdair Nicolson's work I don't know, but I really think he should have decided between the 3 titles he obviously had in mind for the piece.

Tavener and Penderecki: I'd expect less of a new work by either of them than of an old one, but I still have some time for Penderecki when he's not 'lumbering', and it would be mildly interesting to see whether Tavener's recent ecumenical broadening (is that a tautology??) continues apace.

Saariaho I still find thin and overrated, but her vocal works and in particular her operas seem a little more substantial, and if only by virtue of text and action tend to feel slightly less like 'more of the same (scratchy cellos, breathy flutes etc.)'. I'd certainly give Adriana Mater a go.

Judith Weir I'm about to mention in the thread that's just started on her.

Dominic Muldowney is an excellent composer, though I'm afraid any sense of anticipation I might have wanted to share is tempered by the title of his new piece. I'm prepared, as ever, to be proved wrong.
Logged

The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
George Garnett
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 3855



« Reply #2 on: 16:59:47, 08-04-2007 »

Many thank for that t-i-n, not least the enthusiasm for Julian Anderson's Symphony which has persuaded me to go along.

My fault on Alasdair Nicholson's piece, I think. The work is called 'The Broken Symphony' and comes in two parts, Part 1: Endless Laments and Part 2: Ghost Dances.  For reasons which may or may not become clearer at the concert, the two parts are being played separately with Brahms No 3 in the middle (shome filler).     

« Last Edit: 17:06:22, 08-04-2007 by George Garnett » Logged
richard barrett
Guest
« Reply #3 on: 17:20:26, 08-04-2007 »

On the other hand...

I don't think I'd cross the road to hear any of that stuff myself, George, though I'm sure that won't come as much of a surprise. Whatever one might think in the end of some of the odd choices of new works going on up at the BBCSSO, their programming makes a list like this look pedestrian.
Logged
Ian Pace
Temporary Restriction
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4190



« Reply #4 on: 17:32:34, 08-04-2007 »

Can't say much of it excites me either. A proposal for an alternative twelve works:

Richard Barrett - Vanity
Sylvano Bussotti - The Rara Requiem
Jani Christou - Enantiodromia (or any of his orchestral works)
Pascal Dusapin - L'Aven for flute and orchestra
Michael Finnissy - Pathways of Sun and Stars
Francisco Guerrero - Coma Berenices (as with Christou)
Hans-Joachim Hespos - AIR 2 for Ulrike Spies and orchestra
Horatiu Radulescu - Angolo Divino
Karin Rehnqvist - When the Earth Sings
Mathias Spahlinger - passage/paysage
Christian Wolff - John, David for percussion solo and orchestra
B.A. Zimmermann - Requiem fur einen Jungen Dichter

(haven't heard all of these, but would like to)
Logged

'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Ian Pace
Temporary Restriction
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4190



« Reply #5 on: 17:37:23, 08-04-2007 »

Ah, there were fourteen, not twelve. So, two more:

Dieter Schnebel - Sinfonie X
Galina Ustvolskaya - Symphony No. 2: True and Eternal Bliss
Logged

'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
George Garnett
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 3855



« Reply #6 on: 18:33:11, 08-04-2007 »

On the other hand...

I don't think I'd cross the road to hear any of that stuff myself, George, though I'm sure that won't come as much of a surprise.

Fair enough, Richard! Though, as you say, it doesn't actually come as a falling-off-perch surprise Cheesy.

Perhaps this isn't a real question at all but I'll risk it anyway: do you mean by that (very broadly speaking) 'This really isn't the sort of music which needs to be written at the moment' or 'This isn't terribly good music'? Or maybe (particularly from a composer's point of view?) those two amount to much the same thing?

     
Logged
richard barrett
Guest
« Reply #7 on: 20:49:44, 08-04-2007 »

Quote
do you mean by that (very broadly speaking) 'This really isn't the sort of music which needs to be written at the moment' or 'This isn't terribly good music'?
Neither really. (Or maybe a smidgin of both.) On the one hand I wouldn't want to set myself up as someone who decides what needs to be written (except in connection with my own activities), and on the other there are people whose opinions I respect who might speak highly of Anderson or whoever, so I wouldn't want to characterise it crassly as "good" or "bad", just "of no interest to me (at this point)". However, the point I wanted to make was that the selection here ranges from one end of the middle of the road to the other, and as such doesn't reflect the diversity of contemporary composition as well as it might.
Logged
time_is_now
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4653



« Reply #8 on: 21:14:16, 08-04-2007 »

Quote
do you mean by that (very broadly speaking) 'This really isn't the sort of music which needs to be written at the moment' or 'This isn't terribly good music'?
Neither really. (Or maybe a smidgin of both.) On the one hand I wouldn't want to set myself up as someone who decides what needs to be written (except in connection with my own activities), and on the other there are people whose opinions I respect who might speak highly of Anderson or whoever, so I wouldn't want to characterise it crassly as "good" or "bad", just "of no interest to me (at this point)". However, the point I wanted to make was that the selection here ranges from one end of the middle of the road to the other, and as such doesn't reflect the diversity of contemporary composition as well as it might.

Agree with all that, and glad you didn't go (at least not wholeheartedly) for either of those two options. On the other hand, I can't really see any great potential in a simple reversal of the situation described by your last statement. [goes off to re-read the statement in question] Well, OK, I can agree with that 'as well as it might'. But I'm somehow made uncomfortable by the idea of a BBC SO programmer simply trying to 'reflect the diversity of contemporary composition' to a greater degree. Not sure if this is a helpful comment in terms of programming policy, but I guess I could argue that since composers (at least, worthwhile ones) don't tend to cultivate their styles in response to a perceived need for diversity (which is not to say that diversity may not be the end result of their various endeavours), it's a little unnatural for programmers to think in those terms either.

None of which is to say that it wouldn't be a good idea for the BBC SO, and various other programmers, to step back from time to time and notice that the world is a bit bigger than they sometimes seem to remember. But in the meantime, I'm not too unhappy with a situation in which a composer whose work I value can say: 'This is possibly interesting to someone else, and I'm not passing judgment; I have my own work to get on with, and various things I'll happily listen to that may or may not, directly or indirectly, feed that work; but there are plenty of other things that don't fall into that category and that I'll simply leave to others to enjoy or not as they wish (which, of course, doesn't mean that there aren't other things that I think should be spoken out against ...).'
Logged

The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
Ian Pace
Temporary Restriction
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4190



« Reply #9 on: 21:19:37, 08-04-2007 »

I wonder if there's a bit of 'middle-of-the-road music represents most people's least-worst option, and so won't raise too many eyebrows' underlying the programming policy, here and elsewhere?

Inevitably, when programming decisions are made, someone is at least indirectly passing judgement on, if not what should be written exactly, what should (and shouldn't) receive public performances. It would be impossible to programme everything; even if one is not saying 'this is good, and this is bad', the fact that some composers/works/types of works are performed and others aren't (or much less often) implies value judgements in this respect, unless the approach is more tokenistic, as I think would be implied by the possibility I mention at the beginning of this message.
Logged

'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Ian Pace
Temporary Restriction
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4190



« Reply #10 on: 21:23:34, 08-04-2007 »

I'm not too unhappy with a situation in which a composer whose work I value can say: 'This is possibly interesting to someone else, and I'm not passing judgment; I have my own work to get on with, and various things I'll happily listen to that may or may not, directly or indirectly, feed that work; but there are plenty of other things that don't fall into that category and that I'll simply leave to others to enjoy or not as they wish (which, of course, doesn't mean that there aren't other things that I think should be spoken out against ...).'

Yes, that does seem reasonable. That said, in terms of composers' own works, do you not also think there are cases of some of them thinking 'This is the type of music I need to write if I'm going to get performed by X/Y/Z at venues/festivals like XX/YY/ZZ?'. And that as a result, some others who do not wish to adopt this somewhat cynical approach naturally would get frustrated and antipathetic towards certain types of programming possibility, and are thus within their rights to criticise it?
Logged

'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
time_is_now
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4653



« Reply #11 on: 21:25:06, 08-04-2007 »

I wonder if there's a bit of 'middle-of-the-road music represents most people's least-worst option, and so won't raise too many eyebrows' underlying the programming policy, here and elsewhere?

Ah, well, now if that's what they were thinking then that would go entirely against my idea that programmers shouldn't be thinking in terms of ticking boxes, wouldn't it!

And I wouldn't entirely discount the possibility of what you say being true. I suppose all I'll say is, I'm glad at least a couple of good works got through nonetheless (and even gladder that some less middle-of-the-road* works have got through in the past couple of years ...).


*Re 'middle-of-the-road': I'm half tempted to say de facto that this term must be misapplied in describing any work I really think is worthwhile. Which would make it a simple cataloguing error rather than having to account for the fact that some 'middle-of-the-road' works are interesting/worthwhile and others aren't. Interested in Richard's and others' thoughts on this (Richard's particularly, in the light of, for instance, his recent Dutilleux listening experiences ...).
Logged

The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
time_is_now
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4653



« Reply #12 on: 21:26:01, 08-04-2007 »

In terms of composers' own works, do you not also think there are cases of some of them thinking 'This is the type of music I need to write if I'm going to get performed by X/Y/Z at venues/festivals like XX/YY/ZZ?'. And that as a result, some others who do not wish to adopt this somewhat cynical approach naturally would get frustrated and antipathetic towards certain types of programming possibility, and are thus within their rights to criticise it?

Yes.
Logged

The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
richard barrett
Guest
« Reply #13 on: 21:34:47, 08-04-2007 »

Well, I started listening to Dutilleux at a tender age, probably around the time the LP of Rostropovich playing his cello concerto came out, so the recent experiences have been more of a reacquaintance. I suppose it could be describd from some angles as "middle of the road", though as I mentioned I was struck by the way its sounds seem sometimes to anticipate those of "musique spectrale", and let's not forget Dutilleux is of the generation of Britten, more or less. However, there are the far sides of the road as well - I'm not talking about box-ticking, but (for example) the idea of commissioning new works from people like John Oswald and Chris Cutler, who don't even have boxes to tick where orchestral music is concerned. Now I wasn't so keen on the resulty of that particular project, but it showed that the BBCSSO programmers were willing to stick their necks out on the chance that such an idea might yield interesting results, rather than doing what the BBCSO seem to be up to and just looking for things that "work".
Logged
time_is_now
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 4653



« Reply #14 on: 22:00:08, 08-04-2007 »

I suppose what I was getting at was that 'middle of the road', while possibly true, is not something I tend to think about very much except when the music's not doing it for me ... which, I suppose, going all analytic-philosopher for a minute, must mean that it's something other than the presence/absence of 'middle-of-road-ness' which causes the music to do/not to do it for me.

As for 'things that "work"', well, I suppose that's fine, except that I imagine a fair number of the pieces listed above wouldn't 'work' (for me at least). Indeed, JA's Symphony didn't, the first time I heard it. But it does now. And indeed, contains a fair few things that would relate it more closely to 'musique spectrale' than to the smittims-anointed 'BBC mainstream' of Benjamin, Bingham, Beamish, Burrell, Adès and Weir. But then, perhaps you're more impressed by the anticipation of those things in mid-C20th music than by their renewal/extension in the early C21st. I find this whole business of 'timeliness' a pretty hard one to call.
Logged

The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
 
Jump to: