Yes, I agree. I was about to switch off and go to sleep, but I stopped to listen (and then didn't sleep most of the night, but I don't think that was because I couldn't work out what friends were for).

I could be picky of course. I was a bit irritated by the fact that someone who presumably wrote his own essay couldn't actually read it aright—got the stress in the wrong place several times. Rather too much summary of the views of Aristotle and a bit too quick to conclude that Aristotle's views just reflected the historical context of the ancient polis rather than capturing the idea that they were presented on philosophical grounds that might still hold today (about the nature and excellence of a human life in community: so much the worse for our urban lifestyles, perhaps). But then Justin Champion's a historian not a philosopher.  Also a pity about the pronunciation of eudaimonia, philos, Dionysius and Pythias (or did he mean Phintias?).  Justin Champion's evidently not a classical scholar either.

Some nice extracts from Aristotle and Cicero and so on, read very nicely indeed by the professional reader.

I'm sure it does still exist t-p. I have a few true friends - and many acquaintances! Don't get too cynical: surely it's better to trust people and be conned once in a while than never to trust anyone.

When I was growing up, my Mum, an English teacher, used to advise me a lot via Shakespeare - a great love of hers.

From Hamlet: "This above all, to thine own self be true..."

and, on friendship: "the friends thou hast, and their adoption tried - grapple them to thy soul with hoops of steel".  The important words here are "and their adoption tried".

As always, Shakespeare, the great psychologist, hits the nail on the head.

If you have any problem understanding the language of Shakespeare in this casde - though your English is very good and seems to improve daily - please ask. I'm sure any of us will be happy to explain further...

bws Simon

things have evolved to 'buddies' in some sense, one has long lasting friends but also 'curry club' buddies, art gallery 'buddies', concert 'buddies' etc. etc.

I like shakespeare at the globe or in film version, filmed plays are usually very dry though can be good 'live'.

I have moved around and find 'my tribe' via my hobbies, cultured folk tend to hang around concerts,opera,ballet,philosophy groups.

I think the chap in 'the english patient' said something about 'countries are just lines on a map, we are the nations'.

A little snippet of Ibsen to go with the Shakespeare:

John Gabriel Borkman: In other words you have been lying to me all these years!

Vilhelm Foldal: I've never lied, John Gabriel.

Borkman: Haven't you sat here and built up my hopes and beliefs with lies?

Foldal : It wasn't a lie. We believed in each other. As long as you believed in me as a poet, I believed in you in your vocation.

Borkman: Then we have deceived each other. And perhaps we have deceived ourselves too.

Foldal: But isn't that what friendship is, John Gabriel?

Wow, t-p! What a compliment - but it's far beyond me, I'm afraid.

However, though I don't know what the construction is technically called (ff would, if he were here, which he's not ), the piece I quoted means "the friends you have, whose state of friendship with you (i.e. whose "adoption" as friends) you have tested and found reliable".

"To try" can be used in the sense of "to test", you see. And Shakespeare implies, with his wording, that the particular friends he's referring to have not only had their friendship tested, but they have also passed that test.

That's the great gift of the man: he could use so few words to make such deep points... Wonderful stuff. (Thanks, Mum, for introducing me to it!)

bws Simon