|
trained-pianist
|
 |
« Reply #15 on: 14:53:39, 23-02-2007 » |
|
I can not find paragraphe on thumb passing in Rosen book. I have it in from of me now, but can not find.
I was tought to do it differently by two teachers. One in my childhood said that I have to turn the thumb in right away, the other tought me to play by positions, so there was not much thumb passing.
I came back right now to ideas of my first teacher.
The best book for me for piano technique so far was by Gerig Famous pianists and their technique. Amy Fay is quoted in the book: I think my grand trouble all these years has been a stiff wrist and a heavy arm, whereas the whole weight and power must be just in the tips of the fingers, the wrist and arm must be quite light and free, the hand turning upon the wrist as if it were a pivot.
Leschetisky: I have yet to discover whether you can ever put freedom and sureness together.
I like the description there of playing e major scale: The principal of playing a scale is not to turn the thumb under, but to turn a little on each finger and pressing it firmly down on the key and screwing it round, as it were, on a pivot till the next finger broght over its own key. In this way he prepares for the thumb, which is kept free from the hand and slightly curved.
Anyway without expression and clear idea of the sound technical exercises are pointless.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
roslynmuse
|
|
« Reply #16 on: 15:36:35, 23-02-2007 » |
|
"Anyway without expression and clear idea of the sound technical exercises are pointless." Have you read any of Abby Whiteside's writings? She was violently anti technical exercises. (But fascinating on technique!) I haven't got Rosen's book here, but I remember it was quite near the beginning and he says something to the effect that he has never passed his thumb under in all his career! I'm not going to go into my thoughts and feelings about pedagogic dogma here - maybe we could start a new thread  - but so much teaching seems to me to be the passing on of received, but only partly digested, wisdom. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
trained-pianist
|
|
« Reply #17 on: 15:44:23, 23-02-2007 » |
|
Yes, indeed, I found Rosen discussing how to play C major scale.
It is good to have a new thread on teaching, but not too many people will be interested. I find it hard to teach and try to get inspiration by playing chamber music and solo repertoire myself.
I think I should read the book again.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #18 on: 15:48:10, 23-02-2007 » |
|
I'm not going to go into my thoughts and feelings about pedagogic dogma here - maybe we could start a new thread - but so much teaching seems to me to be the passing on of received, but only partly digested, wisdom. We should certainly have a thread on that - where would be the best sub-forum? |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
roslynmuse
|
|
« Reply #19 on: 16:02:29, 23-02-2007 » |
|
I'm not going to go into my thoughts and feelings about pedagogic dogma here - maybe we could start a new thread - but so much teaching seems to me to be the passing on of received, but only partly digested, wisdom. We should certainly have a thread on that - where would be the best sub-forum? Well, there was a composition teaching thread - where did that go? I'll give it some thought later this evening! |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #20 on: 16:05:03, 23-02-2007 » |
|
George - how about a cover for 'The Singing Neanderthals'? Um, if, embarrassed blush, I knew how to do it .... If, however someone very kindly did one then I would delete this message so it would be my little secret that I am up against my computer literacy limits with his one. Very well:  To do it is not difficult - go to Google, click on 'Images', and search for the book (or other image) you are looking for. Then click on the one that looks the best size (from the description), then on 'See full-size image' at the top. The picture itself will then appear on its own, at the full size. Copy the link in the URL bar, then on here, click the second from left button on the second row (under the italic button), and both 'img' and '/img' will appear (both in square brackets) and the cursor will move to between them. Simply copy the URL in there, and the picture will appear when you post. Try it with another book, see if it works! If you hit 'quote' on my message, you'll see the code that produces the image above - have a look at that then delete it, and insert your own! |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #21 on: 16:11:39, 23-02-2007 » |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
trained-pianist
|
|
« Reply #22 on: 16:37:41, 23-02-2007 » |
|
We can ask Michael to make a thread for us and put their all post that are connected to piano playing because I don't think violin players (or wind for that matter) would be interested to read it.
I find that piano playing and string playing has a lot in common. First of all they also have to be flexible in bow holding. They also have to use upper arm as this kind of playing produces better sound and more subtle performance. Also shoulders should not be raised.
I think that Leschetizky said that he has no method. Indeed it is difficult to have a method. Neihaus in his book says that the best position on the piano is the one you can change easiest of all. I read Neuhaus book in Russian and I think it is a good book, but I did not learn much practical things from it for myself.
Did anybody read Gyorgy Sandor book? Is it good?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #23 on: 16:42:13, 23-02-2007 » |
|
We can ask Michael to make a thread for us and put their all post that are connected to piano playing because I don't think violin players (or wind for that matter) would be interested to read it.
I find that piano playing and string playing has a lot in common. First of all they also have to be flexible in bow holding. They also have to use upper arm as this kind of playing produces better sound and more subtle performance. Also shoulders should not be raised.
I think that Leschetizky said that he has no method. Indeed it is difficult to have a method. Neihaus in his book says that the best position on the piano is the one you can change easiest of all. I read Neuhaus book in Russian and I think it is a good book, but I did not learn much practical things from it for myself.
Did anybody read Gyorgy Sandor book? Is it good?
Have to keep up with this!  (could only find a small one. You should try adding the images, though!) Neuhaus is OK, but heavier on rhetoric and generalities than specifics, I feel. And reflects particular Slavic-school biases very strongly. Do read Sándor's book, I think you'd find it good. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
George Garnett
|
|
« Reply #24 on: 17:30:38, 23-02-2007 » |
|
    Now then, Will it work? I have a feeling they will come out as very different sizes. One of them is a bit ungracious given Ian's very kind tutelage in how to do this but all is fair in love and googling etc. Hmmm. Now why didn't that last one work? Aha! Hmm. Quite tricky for us beginners. |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: 17:47:00, 23-02-2007 by George Garnett »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
trained-pianist
|
|
« Reply #25 on: 17:35:24, 23-02-2007 » |
|
George Garnett. I read all Mozart's letters translated by Anderson. I was fascinated with his personality. It was very interesting. Yes, he was not practical and his ideas about friends donating money for him to live on are naive.
Beethoven's letters show much more practical mind.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #26 on: 17:38:16, 23-02-2007 » |
|
What was the last one, George? (one more tip - you can get several books on one line, just by not putting carriage returns between them, makes the posts a bit less vertically cumbersome) Great choices, by the way! Here's another great book which I'm sure you know:  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
calum da jazbo
|
|
« Reply #27 on: 17:40:59, 23-02-2007 » |
|
 these lectures were an inspiration the first second .......time around. the book is nice but you really have to see them. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
It's just a matter of time before we're late.
|
|
|
|
Ian Pace
|
|
« Reply #28 on: 17:45:22, 23-02-2007 » |
|
Now then, Will it work? I have a feeling they will come out as very diffeent sizes. One of them is a bit ungracious given Ian's very kind tutelage in how to do this but all is fair in love and googling etc.
Hmmm. Now why didn't that last one work?
Aha!
George, you render my comments out-of-date by the fact that you have changed the messages! But with respect to the last of those books, perhaps one should also read this after doing so:  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
|
|
|
|
George Garnett
|
|
« Reply #29 on: 17:52:33, 23-02-2007 » |
|
I'll raise you   But, OK, I'll put the Eugene Lunn on my reading list. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
