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Author Topic: Poetry Appreciation Thread.  (Read 19823 times)
Turfan Fragment
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Formerly known as Chafing Dish


« Reply #870 on: 01:07:37, 26-10-2008 »

Yannis Ritsos of the Week:




CONDENSATION

He placed the fish on the chair.
The woman fell asleep in the mirror.
The fresh butter is in the refrigerator. The salt
is in a small plastic bag. My children — he said —
(he said it turned to the wall from which all the pictures
had been removed). My children, my children — he repeated —
the best are the dead; I am not;
I stash myself naked in my hollow wooden horse;
I sit cramped; I light a cigarette; I put it out; I fear
lest the smoke escape through the horse's eyes and it betray me.

Athens, January 7, 1972
Translation: Kostas Myrsiades
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time_is_now
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« Reply #871 on: 23:02:20, 26-10-2008 »

Oh yes, we did that one, DB, Not to mention The Highwayman, by Alfred Noyes, which I adored. WHY?

Blood-red were his spurs in the golden noon, wine-red was his velvet coat,
When they shot him down on the highway,
Down like a dog on the highway,
And he lay in his blood on the highway,
With a bunch of lace at his throat.

The score of Harrison Birtwistle's saxophone concerto Panic is headed with this epigraph:

Oh what is he doing the great god Pan
Down by the reeds by the river
Spreading ruin and scattering ban?


to which Birtwistle appends the comment: "something I remember from school but can't remember by whom (A.A. Noyes maybe?)".

It's actually by Elizabeth Barrett Browning.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
time_is_now
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« Reply #872 on: 23:05:51, 26-10-2008 »

‘Something’s Gotta Hold Of My Heart’ by R.Cook and R. Greenaway, recorded by Gene Pitney
I thought Gene Pitney sang 'Something's Gotten Hold of My Heart'. (Oddly, the poem switches to 'gotten' the second time the phrase occurs.)

Of course, being a bit young for the original I first knew the song through Gene Pitney's re-recording of it as a duet with Marc Almond. Not sure if I had the single (I suppose Pitney's earlier recording might have been the B-side if so) but that was certainly in my avid Top of the Pops-watching years.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
SH
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Posts: 101



« Reply #873 on: 10:00:03, 27-10-2008 »

it's November, child, and time goes
in little bursts    a warm room
clean and squeaky as an orange pip
in a wet landscape

Denise Riley, from Marxism for Infants

***

This is an old fiction of reliability

is a weather presence, is a righteousness
is arms in cotton

this is what stands up in kitchens
is a true storm shelter
& is taken straight out of colonial history, master and slave

arms that I will not love folded nor admire for their ‘strength’
linens that I will not love folded but will see flop open
tables that will rise heavily in the new wind & lift away, bearing their precious burdens

of mothers who never were, nor white nor black
mothers who were always a set of equipment and a fragile balance
mothers who looked over a gulf through the cloud of an act & at times speechlessly saw it

inside a designation there are people permanently started to bear it, the not-me against sociology
inside the kitchens there is realising of tightropes
Milk, if I do not continue to love you as deeply and truly as you want and need
that is us in the mythical streets again

support, support

the houses are murmuring with many small pockets of emotion
on which spongy grounds adults lives are being erected and paid for daily
while their feet and their children’s feet are tangled around like those of fen larks
in the fine steely wires which run to and fro between love and economics


affections must not support the rent


I. neglect. the house

Denise Riley, AFFECTIONS MUST NOT
« Last Edit: 10:04:44, 27-10-2008 by SH » Logged
Andy D
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« Reply #874 on: 10:40:19, 30-10-2008 »

In natural speech one would expect the stresses to fall on the second and seventh syllables, Mistress K.: Aber-BROTH-uck (the last syllable being both indeterminate and unstressed). The fact that the contraction ArbROATH, which has now replaced the original name completely, maintains that stress is a very clear indication of how it must have been pronounced originally (and with a long, slightly closed  'o' sound similar to the Scandinavian, to boot).

It is clear from the rhyme scheme, however (where both 'rock' and 'shock' are offered as rhymes) that Southey was either unaware of the actual scansion, or was else unable to cope with it, so I would hazard a guess that he was calculating that the stress should fall on the second and eight syllables, and expecting a smaller one on the fifth to reinforce the consonance of the two 'Ab' syllables in close proximity: The ABB-ott of AB-er-broth-OCK. (3/1-2-3/1-2-3/1)

During the poet's lifetime (1774 -1843), travel was considerably more of an undertaking than it is now, and although Scotland was becoming part of the Grand Tour, it was the west rather than the east coast which drew most visitors. It is very possible, therefore, that Southey was simply reproducing the name as he assumed it must sound without ever having heard it correctly pronounced, thus leading to this confusion.

By coincidence, we looked at Robert Southey and Robert Bridges in my poetry group last night and someone read The Inchcape Rock. I remembered that Ron had said it was really Arbroath but not all he'd posted about the correct pronunciation.
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Mrs. Kerfoops
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« Reply #875 on: 11:24:45, 30-10-2008 »

   . . . And I can feel
   Thy follies, too; and with a just disdain
   Frown at effeminates, whose very looks
   Reflect dishonour on the land I love.
   How, in the name of soldiership and sense,
   Should England prosper, when such things, as smooth
   And tender as a girl, all essenc'd o'er
   With odours, and as profligate as sweet;
   Who sell their laurel for a myrtle wreath,
   And love when they should fight; when such as these
   Presume to lay their hand upon the ark
   Of her magnificent and awful cause?
   . . .


                   Just one of those things . . .
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SH
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Posts: 101



« Reply #876 on: 13:51:26, 02-11-2008 »

Summer Sadness (From Mallarmé)

The sun runs a lazy tub in your hair's goldness.
Fighter, asleep on the sand,
And, burning incense on your traitor jowl,
Folds-in your tears to a love potion.

The changeless lull of this white blaze
Has made my timid kisses say in sadness:
            "Never shall we rest, a lonely mummy
             Under the antique desert and the happy palms!"

But your hair's a lukewarm river:
A place for drowning, coldly, the soul that haunts us
And for finding this 'Nothingness' you do not know!

I'll lick the shadow from your lidded eyes
To see if it will lend the heart you batter
The insensibility of the stones and sky.

Peter Manson, from For the Good of Liars, Barque Press 2006
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Turfan Fragment
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Formerly known as Chafing Dish


« Reply #877 on: 03:55:10, 03-11-2008 »

Keep 'em coming, SH's mangy patella!

Yannis Ritsos of the week:

THE USEFULNESS OF ART

It was not only those that came of themselves,
those that were, the inevitable, but also the others,
those he himself added, those he wanted or the others wanted,
those he chose, and the manner in which they multiplied or were added.

And perhaps these last were particularly his,
that continued as arrested or diffused things,
presenting a story or a face to the immobile like a transparent windowpane
that suddenly thickens when darkness comes and turns into a mirror,
presenting noble performances out of unsuspecting events,
presenting their forms and their phantoms, presenting
the interior of nocturnal rooms illuminated by lamps or by a bouquet of flowers,
or by anger or privation or poverty. Presenting
things known and unknown, known in another way,
in a sequence, even though constrained in a value at least interchangeable.
« Last Edit: 17:24:54, 03-11-2008 by Turfan Fragment » Logged

time_is_now
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« Reply #878 on: 17:23:02, 03-11-2008 »

What's a ting? Is Yannis Ritsos Irish?

When do we get Turfan Fragment's cycle of Ritsos settings? Are you writing one a week as you post the texts??
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
Turfan Fragment
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Posts: 1330


Formerly known as Chafing Dish


« Reply #879 on: 17:26:12, 03-11-2008 »

Just tell me you like his poems, tinners, and I'll be genuinely happy. Considering you nixed Alan Dugan. Your opinion does matter to me.

No, I don't 'set' poetry without a handsome commission and a personal letter from the poet's grandmother pleading with me in the sense of a dying wish.
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martle
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« Reply #880 on: 18:24:58, 03-11-2008 »

 Cheesy
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Green. Always green.
SH
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« Reply #881 on: 10:04:50, 04-11-2008 »

From Rothenberg & Joris's irritating and useful anthology Poems for the Millennium [vol. 2] Yannis Ritsos: "Probably one of the most prolific poets ever (a writing schedule of one to sixteen poems a day; more than five thousand pages of his "selected" poems alone)." Hmm.

I like the texts you've posted, a great deal.

Keep 'em coming, SH's mangy patella!

Why not Smiley The final, wonderful stanzas of Chaucer's Troilus and Criseyde.

               And whan that he was slayn in this manere,
               His lighte goost ful blisfully is went
               Up to the holownesse of the seventh spere,
               In convers letinge every element; 
               And ther he saugh, with ful avysement,
               The erratik sterres, herkeninge armonye
               With sownes fulle of hevenish melodye.

               And doun from thennes faste he gan avyse
               This litel spot of erthe, that with the see 
               Embraced is, and fully gan despyse
               This wrecched world, and held al vanitee
               To respect of the pleyn felicitee
               That is in hevene above; and at the laste,
               Ther he was slayn, his loking doun he caste; 

               And in him-self he lough right at the wo
               Of hem that wepten for his deeth so faste;
               And dampned al our werk that folweth so
               The blinde lust, the which that may not laste,
               And sholden al our herte on hevene caste. 
               And forth he wente, shortly for to telle,
               Ther as Mercurie sorted him to dwelle. —

               Swich fyn hath, lo, this Troilus for love,
               Swich fyn hath al his grete worthinesse;
               Swich fyn hath his estat real above, 
               Swich fyn his lust, swich fyn hath his noblesse;
               Swich fyn hath false worldes brotelnesse.
               And thus bigan his lovinge of Criseyde,
               As I have told, and in this wyse he deyde.

               O yonge fresshe folkes, he or she, 
               In which that love up groweth with your age,
               Repeyreth hoom from worldly vanitee,
               And of your herte up-casteth the visage
               To thilke god that after his image
               Yow made, and thinketh al nis but a fayre 
               This world, that passeth sone as floures fayre.

               And loveth him, the which that right for love
               Upon a cros, our soules for to beye,
               First starf, and roos, and sit in hevene a-bove;
               For he nil falsen no wight, dar I seye, 
               That wol his herte al hoolly on him leye.
               And sin he best to love is, and most meke,
               What nedeth feyned loves for to seke?

               Lo here, of Payens corsed olde rytes,
               Lo here, what alle hir goddes may availle; 
               Lo here, these wrecched worldes appetytes;
               Lo here, the fyn and guerdon for travaille
               Of Iove, Appollo, of Mars, of swich rascaille!
               Lo here, the forme of olde clerkes speche
               In poetrye, if ye hir bokes seche. — 

               O moral Gower, this book I directe
               To thee, and to the philosophical Strode,
               To vouchen sauf, ther nede is, to corecte,
               Of your benignitees and zeles gode.
               And to that sothfast Crist, that starf on rode, 
               With al myn herte of mercy ever I preye;
               And to the lord right thus I speke and seye:

               Thou oon, and two, and three, eterne on-lyve,
               That regnest ay in three and two and oon,
               Uncircumscript, and al mayst circumscryve, 
               Us from visible and invisible foon
               Defende; and to thy mercy, everichoon,
               So make us, Iesus, for thy grace digne,
               For love of mayde and moder thyn benigne! Amen.

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time_is_now
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« Reply #882 on: 11:55:54, 04-11-2008 »

irritating and useful anthology
Cheesy

I'm still making my mind up about Yannis Ritsos, Turf. I'll come back on this.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
Mary Chambers
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« Reply #883 on: 12:56:43, 04-11-2008 »

Ah, Chaucer - ages since I've read that. Thank you.

I was going to post Hardy's At Day-close in November, but a quick search shows I posted it on this day last year. I think I still will, though. I think of this poem almost every day at this time of year.

The ten hours' light is abating,
And a late bird wings across,
Where the pines like waltzers waiting
Give their black heads a toss.

Beech leaves, that yellow the noon-time
Float past like specks in the eye.
I set every tree in my June-time,
And now they obscure the sky.

And the children who ramble through here
Conceive that there never has been
A time when no tall trees grew here,
And none will in time be seen.
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time_is_now
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« Reply #884 on: 13:21:03, 04-11-2008 »

I've just re-read TF's Alan Dugan and like it better now.

I find the Hardy frustrating, especially the line 'I set every tree in my June-time'. I know what it means (what he wants it to mean), but it relies too much (for my liking) on the reader acquiescing in an imprecision caused by the attempt to render feeling and sense in a syntactical and expressive language which is not up to the task, or which has been insufficiently honed for the task. I'd rather have an ironic disjunction of the 'container' to the 'content' than this inept sincerity, though I'd prefer real sincerity to either if it could be shown to be possible.

It's nowhere near as bad as this effort from Edward Thomas, however, which I had to read recently and which magnifies the faults of that line in the Hardy a thousand-fold:


The Ash Grove

Half of the grove stood dead, and those that yet lived made
Little more than the dead ones made of shade.
If they led to a house, long before they had seen its fall:
But they welcomed me; I was glad without cause and delayed.

Scarce a hundred paces under the trees was the interval
Paces each sweeter than sweetest miles but nothing at all,
Not even the spirits of memory and fear with restless wing,
Could climb down in to molest me over the wall

That I passed through at either end without noticing.
And now an ash grove far from those hills can bring
The same tranquillity in which I wander a ghost
With a ghostly gladness, as if I heard a girl sing

The song of the Ash Grove soft as love uncrossed,
And then in a crowd or in distance it were lost,
But the moment unveiled something unwilling to die
And I had what most I desired, without search or desert or cost.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
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