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Author Topic: Music Periodicals  (Read 4296 times)
increpatio
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« Reply #165 on: 15:07:17, 22-08-2007 »

This is very interesting - is this move confined for the moment just to mathematicians? It seems to me that their gripes are pretty universal across the disciplines, or are mathematicians just naturally more militant?

I think it's being led by mathematicians, but effects all sciences; see http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/journals.html for an article on it.  Interestingly enough, theoretical physicists seem to have little trouble with it, as almost all papers, in addition to appearing in journals, are simultaneously made freely available on www.arxiv.org  (also a lot of mathematics papers, and some papers in the other sciences).  The only other actions I have heard of were of some Computer Science editorial board resigning.  But I haven't actively checked up on the matter for other areas of research.
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increpatio
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« Reply #166 on: 15:15:12, 22-08-2007 »

I do not have to go into reams of detail about each individual philosopher merely in order to declare my attitude for what it is.

No, but that can make discussion rather difficult.  (I don't think anyone is asking you to go into *great* detail either, just enough to keep things earthed).
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TimR-J
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« Reply #167 on: 15:17:17, 22-08-2007 »

I think it's being led by mathematicians, but effects all sciences; see http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/journals.html for an article on it.

Thanks for the link. (For a second I read the author as Joan Baez...)

simultaneously made freely available on www.arxiv.org

Wow, what a site! Now I have discipline envy.
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increpatio
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« Reply #168 on: 15:20:52, 22-08-2007 »

I think it's being led by mathematicians, but effects all sciences; see http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/journals.html for an article on it.

Thanks for the link. (For a second I read the author as Joan Baez...)

They are cousins.

(oh: if nobody starts the thread before me, or something similar, I'll post the thing I had written about the eagleton article tomorrow(I had saved it on my laptop, which has now run out of battery and I forgot to bring my cable in )).
« Last Edit: 16:01:38, 22-08-2007 by increpatio » Logged

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Ian Pace
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« Reply #169 on: 22:04:22, 22-08-2007 »

I have to say that this is not the way in which I read it, although I accept that it could be read in that way; this is perhaps where some of the misunderstanding of my position via-à-vis this may have arisen. It seems to me to be far more concerned to "make an easy target of" certain commentators who name-drop and write extensive footnoes of the suspect kind to which you drew attention than to "make an easy target of" those philosophers and writers themsleves who, it seems to me, are treated as objects rther than subjects in this kind of exercise;
You know, I'd be prepared to have a serious discussion with you on this subject if anything would suggest that you have actually read much of the stuff you like to pronounce upon at every opportunity. It comes across more like anything with long words, or which deals with complex contemporary philosophical issues, is something you deeply fear and are threatened by, and need to denounce whenever you can.

Try some of the Routledge short introductory guides to some of the figures in question - those I've read have been done pretty well, attempted some sort of clarity without compromising their subject.

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I didn't start this thing, of course, but I likewise take leave to doubt that the person who did so had any intention of firing some kind of broadside against those philosophers and writers.
I'm quite sure they did (as does Sokal).
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Ian Pace
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« Reply #170 on: 22:06:14, 22-08-2007 »

I do not have to go into reams of detail about each individual philosopher merely in order to declare my attitude for what it is.
No, but that can make discussion rather difficult.  (I don't think anyone is asking you to go into *great* detail either, just enough to keep things earthed).
Certainly not requiring 'great' detail, just anything at all that's specific.

What would anyone think if someone started very loudly and publicly denouncing areas of writing about twister theory without showing any evidence of knowing anything about it, or having read it?
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
ahinton
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« Reply #171 on: 22:32:14, 22-08-2007 »

I have to say that this is not the way in which I read it, although I accept that it could be read in that way; this is perhaps where some of the misunderstanding of my position via-à-vis this may have arisen. It seems to me to be far more concerned to "make an easy target of" certain commentators who name-drop and write extensive footnoes of the suspect kind to which you drew attention than to "make an easy target of" those philosophers and writers themsleves who, it seems to me, are treated as objects rther than subjects in this kind of exercise;
You know, I'd be prepared to have a serious discussion with you on this subject if anything would suggest that you have actually read much of the stuff you like to pronounce upon at every opportunity. It comes across more like anything with long words, or which deals with complex contemporary philosophical issues, is something you deeply fear and are threatened by, and need to denounce whenever you can.
Here you go again - "the stuff (I) like to pronounce upon at every opportunity"; what does it take to get you to understand that these so-called "pronouncements" are, for the most part, replies to the posts of others, rather than the kind of determined efforts on my part that you seem hell-bent on ascribing to me to rake it all up without prior invitation? I do not know and the extent to which you allow me to try to care is rapidly evaporating, I'm afraid...

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I didn't start this thing, of course, but I likewise take leave to doubt that the person who did so had any intention of firing some kind of broadside against those philosophers and writers.
I'm quite sure they did (as does Sokal).
OK - so that's the way that you read this kind of thing - and that is, of course, your prerogative, just as it is mine to read it as though someone who thought it up is trying to have a dig at the suspect researchers rather than at those figures whose work they (really or purportedly) have a tendency to cite. I may be wrong in my take on this, but that nevertheless IS my take on it in general terms, right, wrong or otherwise.

Best,

Alistair
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ahinton
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« Reply #172 on: 22:34:13, 22-08-2007 »

I do not have to go into reams of detail about each individual philosopher merely in order to declare my attitude for what it is.

No, but that can make discussion rather difficult.  (I don't think anyone is asking you to go into *great* detail either, just enough to keep things earthed).
No, indeed, but my point here was that I surely do not have to into any detail about the subject matter that prompts my attitude here just in order to prove that my attitude is what it is, rather than what certain people might choose for whatever reason or none to think it is!

Best,

Alistair
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