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Author Topic: Vanishing music?  (Read 1926 times)
Tony Watson
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« on: 14:35:28, 03-04-2007 »

An interesting article in today's Guardian about the apparent decline in recording classical music and its consequences, with particular reference to Norman Lebrecht's latest book (whose name evokes strong responses in some of you).

http://music.guardian.co.uk/classical/story/0,,2048916,00.html

I was particularly interested in this phrase:

"The bankruptcy of postwar modernism created a public musical vacuum into which Elvis Presley, the Beatles and Bob Dylan strode, with lasting consequences for classical music."
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richard barrett
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« Reply #1 on: 14:39:10, 03-04-2007 »

"The bankruptcy of postwar modernism created a public musical vacuum into which Elvis Presley, the Beatles and Bob Dylan strode, with lasting consequences for classical music."
Er, so what he's saying is that Presley, the Beatles and Dylan would never have existed if it weren't for Stockhausen and co.? What absolute and utter nonsense.
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time_is_now
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« Reply #2 on: 14:42:59, 03-04-2007 »

Oi, get back to Britten!
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
Tony Watson
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« Reply #3 on: 14:45:47, 03-04-2007 »

I should have said that the article was by Martin Kettle. He does go on to say that classical music needs to reinvent itself as a living art form for the general public. I don't necessarily agree with any of the article but I thought it might stimulate some debate.

I don't believe for a minute that people turned to Presley, et al, because they couldn't dance to Shostakovich, and his music wouldn't fit on 45s, but I think that the explosion in pop music killed off much of light music (the Brian Kaye type) which for many people was a stepping stone to classical and which gave people a taste for orchestral instruments and not just drums and guitars.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #4 on: 15:02:07, 03-04-2007 »

"The bankruptcy of postwar modernism created a public musical vacuum into which Elvis Presley, the Beatles and Bob Dylan strode, with lasting consequences for classical music."
Er, so what he's saying is that Presley, the Beatles and Dylan would never have existed if it weren't for Stockhausen and co.? What absolute and utter nonsense.

I wonder if he's aware of the Beatles' interest in Stockhausen ('A Day in the Life'), also featuring him on their cover?
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
time_is_now
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« Reply #5 on: 15:04:06, 03-04-2007 »

the apparent decline in recording classical music and its consequences, with particular reference to Norman Lebrecht's latest book (whose name evokes strong responses in some of you)

Just received the following by email from the MD of a leading orchestra (beyond which I'm naming no names!):

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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
richard barrett
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« Reply #6 on: 15:05:37, 03-04-2007 »

Quote
t I think that the explosion in pop music killed off much of light music (the Brian Kaye type) which for many people was a stepping stone to classical and which gave people a taste for orchestral instruments and not just drums and guitars
That sounds a lot more plausible than Lebrecht's "idea", which (as usual) seems to have been concocted mainly in order to make a splash for Mr L and sell as many books as possible, rather than out of any real concern for the issues he's talking about. Rumours of the "impending death of classical music" do the rounds every now and again, and the blame for this is often laid at the feet of "modern music"... if only modern music actually had such an influence in the world, as opposed to the multinational corporations which dominate the music industry, both "classical" and otherwise, and whose first loyalty is overwhelmingly to their shareholders and not to music or to the people who listen to it. It's clear that the "industry" is in a state of crisis and contraction, but it's not at all clear to me that this will stop people from wanting to hear the music, by whatever means are available.
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richard barrett
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« Reply #7 on: 15:07:17, 03-04-2007 »


It's traditional for the dog to be facing the gramophone, though.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #8 on: 15:11:34, 03-04-2007 »

It's traditional for the dog to be facing the gramophone, though.

Apparently this wasn't an April Fool's story, though I'm not entirely convinced yet:

http://www.rte.ie/arts/2007/0402/wallaceandgromit.html
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
richard barrett
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« Reply #9 on: 15:18:38, 03-04-2007 »

Would have made a good cover for Lebrecht's book actually.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #10 on: 15:23:54, 03-04-2007 »

Swallow: Richard Barrett, we are here to investigate the cause of death of your listening to your CD, Peter Grimes, whose existence on your hard drive you brought to the board, 'The r3ok' on the 22nd ultimo (http://r3ok.myforum365.com/index.php?topic=705.0 ). Do you wish to give evidence?
....
Swallow: You sailed around the computer with the intention of putting on that recording. Why did you do this?
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
TimR-J
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« Reply #11 on: 15:25:41, 03-04-2007 »

I've definitely seen an HMV poster featuring Gromit recently.

Back to Kettle, he's been touting his 'bankruptcy of modernism gave us Elvis and the Beatles' argument since at least 2005, when he penned this gem.

Oh, and I remain utterly sceptical not only of all Lebrecht's arguments, but also the basic claims he's making about classical recordings, which Alex Ross, for one, has suggested is in rude health in comparison to the rest of the industry.
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time_is_now
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« Reply #12 on: 15:39:37, 03-04-2007 »

Well, Alex Ross has his agendas too (as I realised slowly at first, having counted myself a 'fan'), which largely rely on being able to talk about contemporary music in a way that makes it sound like an attractive niche market choice to cool urban twenty- and thirtysomethings. Far be it from me to become an old fogey at 27, but (as I suspect our cross-Atlantic friends Evan and Aaron would be only too willing to tell you) I don't think all contemporary music proves equally amenable to 'the Ross treatment'.

Which is not that I'm suggesting the small numbers of contemporary composers ( http://www.scena.org/columns/lebrecht/070228-NL-gorecki.html ) who fit Stormin' Norman's curious set of prejudices and preferences are necessarily any better, or worse, off.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
richard barrett
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« Reply #13 on: 16:28:15, 03-04-2007 »

Back to Kettle, he's been touting his 'bankruptcy of modernism gave us Elvis and the Beatles' argument since at least 2005, when he penned this gem.
Oh yes, I remember that now, although it merges into the general miasma of fluff* that is the wisdom of Martin Kettle.

* not sure whether that's exactly what I meant to say, but there's something attractive about the sound of it
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TimR-J
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« Reply #14 on: 16:40:30, 03-04-2007 »

Well, Alex Ross has his agendas too (as I realised slowly at first, having counted myself a 'fan'), which largely rely on being able to talk about contemporary music in a way that makes it sound like an attractive niche market choice to cool urban twenty- and thirtysomethings. Far be it from me to become an old fogey at 27, but (as I suspect our cross-Atlantic friends Evan and Aaron would be only too willing to tell you) I don't think all contemporary music proves equally amenable to 'the Ross treatment'.

I agree, but in a world full of Lebrechts and Kettles give me a Ross any day: he at least generates enthusiasm rather than despair. I'm sure there are as many procedural flaws in Ross's interpretation of the statistics as there are in Lebrecht's (I'm not qualified to assess either), but the fact that one can make such a strong counter argument is at least a powerful tool in exposing (in the sort of cold hard numbers he would appreciate) the basic problems of Lebrecht's arguments.

PS - for those interested, I've written more on this Kettle article on the blog: here's a copy:

Quote
Following in Norman Lebrecht’s footsteps, here comes Martin Kettle, despairing once more over the ‘death’ of a music he seems to care little for (this is, remember, a man who uses phrases like “protestations on behalf of the half-forgotten and semi-famous” and “the shipwreck of modernism” as descriptive of Berio).

As with that ‘Classical music could even become the new rock ‘n roll‘ article (recently re-read, ugh, the things I do for you…), there’s so much wrong with his latest lament for the ‘dying’ classical recording industry (are you going to tell him, or shall I?) that it’s hard to know where to begin.

Firstly, and most prosaically: as Alex has shown, there is plenty of wiggle room to be deeply sceptical about the foundations of Lebrecht’s argument that this is the beginning of the end for classical recordings. Any other sector of the industry - as EMI’s recent monumental backtrack on DRM suggests - would cut off its right arm to have the sales figure rises that classical can boast from the last few years.

There are plenty more points to make here about the inherent long tail-ness of the classical repertoire, an asset that makes it perfect for the internet and less good for bricks and mortar stores with expensive rents on warehouse space, and the continuing reluctance of big music to embrace a truly online model of commerce, but I’ll just stick here with one that seems pertinent to Kettle’s article. In one of his more improbable sentences, he writes

    Because [classical recording companies] generated little or no short-term profitability compared to pop, it is hardly surprising that the corporations lost their nerve, especially as the internet began to expand.

Yup, you read that right. The only way I can see that this sentence even makes sense is if we (and Kettle) buy into big music’s assertion that the internet represents everything wrong with the commercial promotion and distribution of music in the 21st century. If you believe a priori that the internet is going to kill music (as most of the majors apparently still do), then sure, a bigger internet is a bigger bad. On the contrary, if you believe, like all those labels signed up to IODA, that the internet might just be a force for good in finding new audiences for your music, then Kettle’s sentence looks more than a little screwy.

One of the big problems with Kettle’s article is his conflation of a ‘dying classical recording industry’ and a ‘glut of Four Seasons recordings’. Certainly there is a glut of such things (well over 400 Four Seasons), and one of Lebrecht’s more interesting ideas is how this might impinge upon what he calls the “chain of interpretation”, but to claim that any subsequent loss of public interest in such indulgences is due to some sort of artistic collapse and not boardrooms that are fatally losing their way does public tastes a disservice. If this is the measure by which the major label classical recording industry is dying and it still can’t see the problem, then it deserves to die.

To take the next step and claim that this represents the death of an art form is frankly farcical. Any art form with the likes of Kurtág, Lachenmann, Reich, Rihm, Ferneyhough, Saariaho and Ashley all alive and kicking hard at the same time could only be described as extremely fit - and it goes without saying that I’ve hardly scratched the surface of global compositional talent here.

Of course, most of Lebrecht’s arguments only make sense if you turn a deaf ear to the contemporary (recall Pierre-Laurent Aimard or Ian Pace, then see how silly his obituary for the pianist sounds); the same might be said of Kettle’s, and this is the source of my next issue with his piece. For him, that dastardly modern music remains to blame for everything: not only did it kill classical music as a public artform, but it also killed it as a commodity. Overlooking the fact that I know of several composers who would raise a cheer to their success in this respect, it’s basically a crock argument. All that I can see postwar music as responsible for in this respect is a radical uncoupling of ‘modern’ concert music from the rest of the repertoire, and in so many ways this has been an artistically productive achievement. Kettle is profoundly in error when he attempts to imagine a continuous audience for both Brahms and Boulez: one does exist, but it is very small. This is the same fallacy that still encourages promoters to take a sugar/medicine approach to programmes, slipping in small bits of contemporary music amongst the established warhorses, in the mistaken belief that this will make everyone happy, rather than no one. However, the separate audiences for each are relatively large, enthusiastic, and free with their money. The fact that major labels and concert orchestras haven’t in the main found a way to make a living out of these two audiences is the fault only of the industry and not the music itself.
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