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Author Topic: Boosts intelligence, cures Heart Disease - it's Mozart  (Read 359 times)
Reiner Torheit
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« on: 07:59:18, 18-03-2008 »

says the Independent:
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/features/a-medical-maestro-can-mozart-treat-heart-disease-797097.html


Rowlandson's "The Quack Doctor"
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harmonyharmony
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« Reply #1 on: 08:19:32, 18-03-2008 »

If I was played Eine Kleine Nachtmusik for 30 minutes, I don't think that I (unlike the carp) would find that terribly soothing. I might go a bit mad in fact.

There seems to be not enough studies looking into whether it is just Mozart that has this effect or whether it's classical music in general (and as to whether it's the music itself or whether it's a Pavlovian response).

And there seems so rarely to be a musicologist or professional performer asked to participate in these researches.
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Milly Jones
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« Reply #2 on: 09:48:41, 18-03-2008 »

If I remember correctly there was supposed to be a scientific reason behind this.  Mozart apparently composes to a format/brain wavelength that seems particularly beneficial.   Probably pseudo-science, but there was a huge demand a while back to play unborn babies Mozart and then from birth onwards - ostensibly to "boost" intelligence.

I hardly think this is proven science at all but you never know there might be something in it.  Why Mozart and no-one else is the puzzle.  However, the Mozart fanatics among us (myself included) obviously derive something from the music that his detractors do not although you could say that about any composer really.

Let's face it, as scientific theories go, it's a bit pants.  Grin
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perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #3 on: 11:23:23, 18-03-2008 »

I wonder whether the point here is that we know very little about what is generally dismissed as the placebo effect - which seems to me to be a rather snotty way of saying that the body has its own resources of healing ability which need somehow to be triggered. 

It's not just music - I think this is the case with some "alternative" therapies (I dislike the term "alternative", because it turns Western medicine into a baseline, which I don't think is really justified).  Take homeopathy, for example.  Homeopathy is not even pseudo-science; it's utter nonsense.  A GCSE student who came up with the theory of homeopathy would (or ought to be) told by teacher to go away and do something sensible.  But there are undoubtedly people who claim, with justification, that it has made a difference.  What has happened is a sort of placebo effect, but I don't think that to use that terminology to dismiss it is useful (or, strictly speaking, scientific).  Something has happened and the genuine scientific approach is to try and understand it (and, at a secondary level, there is also a question about some of the philosophical and ethical issues that the use of what we think as placebos could give rise to - would it be right for a doctor to prescribe a "medicine" that he knows will not do what he is telling the patient it does?  The issue gives rise to some pretty fundamental questions about the relationship between professional and patient).

So, back to Mozart, we know that music has a powerful impact on mood and emotion (it's why members of this board are here, for a start).  I don't know enough about the brainwave theory, but it could be a starting point.  Is any work being done on Bach, whose qualities of regularity and clarity of structure could have a powerful subliminal effect?

All in all, much more research needed before we can dismiss any of this.
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
richard barrett
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« Reply #4 on: 13:10:31, 18-03-2008 »

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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #5 on: 04:29:30, 29-03-2008 »

More of the same, but this time a bit more reasonable and not specifically (hooray!) linked to Mozart in this BBC piece:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/7319024.stm
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
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perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #6 on: 07:46:52, 29-03-2008 »

... although the article lost much of my sympathy when the second paragraph referred (obliquely) to Brain Gym, which is notoriously a piece of pure charlatanism

http://www.badscience.net/?cat=32
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #7 on: 08:02:56, 29-03-2008 »

Very true...  one can't help noticing that all the "research" into this seems to be conducted by people who are selling something, and stand to gain financially from the "conclusions" Sad

I'm reminded of Mozart's patron when aged 8, Anton Mesmer - who commissioned BASTIEN & BASTIENNE.  Mesmer (who entered the dictionary as the inventor of "Mesmerism", and derivatives such as "mesmerised") claimed to be able to cure major debilitating illnesses (including blindness) with his "hypnotic therapies".  When his attempted cure of the wunderkind pianist Mme Paradis resulted in her permanent blindness, he was chased out of Vienna.  His promises to fund Mozart's Grand Tour of Europe were never honoured.
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #8 on: 08:06:50, 29-03-2008 »

 ... but Mozart revenged himself in Cosi:  I suppose Despina's fake cure, invoking Dr Mesmer, is what he is largely remembered by.  Cheesy
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #9 on: 09:09:02, 29-03-2008 »

Maybe even in B & B?   A village quack fixes love-disputes with a spell that goes "Ziggi-Zaggi Diggi-Daggy"?? Wink   (The text for the number was inserted into the libretto by Leopold Mozart, who'd commissioned it from one of his Court Trumpeters who dabbled in versifying as a sideline.  I can't imagine who it was aimed at Wink )
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
Tony Watson
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« Reply #10 on: 17:33:15, 15-04-2008 »

... although the article lost much of my sympathy when the second paragraph referred (obliquely) to Brain Gym, which is notoriously a piece of pure charlatanism

http://www.badscience.net/?cat=32

I had to attend a "training day" today and the speaker took it as a given that brain gym was highly effective and that everyone should be doing it. When I pointed out that some people had discredited it, he got a little annoyed and said that the trouble with academics was that they had to churn out so-called research in order to justify their jobs. He asked if I had tried it myself and I had to admit that I hadn't.
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perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #11 on: 21:14:04, 15-04-2008 »

... although the article lost much of my sympathy when the second paragraph referred (obliquely) to Brain Gym, which is notoriously a piece of pure charlatanism

http://www.badscience.net/?cat=32

I had to attend a "training day" today and the speaker took it as a given that brain gym was highly effective and that everyone should be doing it. When I pointed out that some people had discredited it, he got a little annoyed and said that the trouble with academics was that they had to churn out so-called research in order to justify their jobs. He asked if I had tried it myself and I had to admit that I hadn't.

The point about Brain Gym is that its two prescriptions - drinking water and taking mild exercise - are bound to be beneficial for kids in the classroom, as indeed they are for anyone else.  What is absolute nonsense is the idea that you need to sign up to an expensive programme supported by a completely bogus set of pseudo-scientific claims in order to achieve these results.  Brain buttons, anyone?  Connecting the left and right sides of the brain?  It's all nonsense.

Here is what happened when the founder of Brain Gym was grilled by Paxman on Newsnight:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjRhYP5faTU






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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
Milly Jones
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« Reply #12 on: 21:44:07, 15-04-2008 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjRhYP5faTU

OMIGOD!  I've just been cringing with embarrassment!  What a complete moron!!!!  I don't like Jeremy Paxman as a rule for his heavy- handedness during interviews but I thought he was uncharacteristically kind with that nutter. He came over as being as thick as two short planks. Oh the shame.  Roll Eyes
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perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #13 on: 22:13:11, 15-04-2008 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjRhYP5faTU

OMIGOD!  I've just been cringing with embarrassment!  What a complete moron!!!!  I don't like Jeremy Paxman as a rule for his heavy- handedness during interviews but I thought he was uncharacteristically kind with that nutter. He came over as being as thick as two short planks. Oh the shame.  Roll Eyes

The sad thing is that this nutter has managed to persuade an awful lot of schools to part with their money - which after all is our money - to buy his product.  Having said that I had expected someone who would give a better account of himself under questioning.

My own brush with Brain Gym came when I was still a school governor, three or four years ago. We had a presentation and demonstration from one of the Brain Gym people (which, inter alia, involved my being inveigled into massaging the school bursar's neck in front of the meeting, which was embarrassing for both of us).  Unfortunately for the salesman, one of my fellow governors was a neurosurgeon from the local hospital, who pointed out, politely but firmly, that his pitch was complete nonsense.
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #14 on: 22:31:25, 15-04-2008 »

Unfortunately for the salesman, one of my fellow governors was a neurosurgeon from the local hospital, who pointed out, politely but firmly, that his pitch was complete nonsense.

It's like that moment in ANNIE HALL where Woody Allen talks direct to screen, "I wish I had Marshall McLuhan here right now to tell this guy that he's completely misunderstood his work?" and McLuhan himself appears.

Sadly in real life such moments are all too rare,  however much we wish for them Wink
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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