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Author Topic: The R3 Opera Quiz - After the Supper Interval  (Read 23591 times)
George Garnett
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« Reply #540 on: 18:15:30, 19-04-2008 »

That's an impressive list for a few minutes whiling, Martle. 

Does Purcell's The Tempest (or The Enchanted Island) j u u u u rst about fall into the category of an opera (in the seventeenth century sense Smiley )? 

Hmmm. Thinks. I wonder if Martle left it out deliberately and I have tumbled clumsily if innocently into the warm embrace of his capacious trap. 
« Last Edit: 18:20:33, 19-04-2008 by George Garnett » Logged
perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #541 on: 18:15:50, 19-04-2008 »

I'd also put in a word of recommendation for the Tippett, IGI - one of his most concentrated works, and as the 1960s recede into history the "contemporary" verbal idioms - which may have been distracting while nearer the time of composition - seem a lot less trying.
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
Don Basilio
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« Reply #542 on: 18:29:40, 19-04-2008 »

Berlioz' Les Troyens, part 2 and Purcell's Dido and Aeneas tell the same story.

I've said it twice before at least and I'll go on saying it.  Purcell's is less than an hour, written for amateur adolescents and saddled with a book of mind-blowingly sillly doggerel ("Thus on the fatal banks of Nile Weeps the deceitful crocodile").  But for my money Purcell knocks spots off Berlioz any day.

There's loads of operas based on post-Troy events, but usually with different stories.

And any other Fall of Troy operas?
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #543 on: 18:31:31, 19-04-2008 »

I'd also put in a word of recommendation for the Tippett, IGI - one of his most concentrated works, and as the 1960s recede into history the "contemporary" verbal idioms - which may have been distracting while nearer the time of composition - seem a lot less trying.

Ah, now I must confess, pw, that I do now have a copy of The Knot Garden, but haven't given it a full listen yet, due to all sorts of work/house related stuff meaning I haven't had time to sit down with the libretto to hand. A couple of weeks ago, tinners, I think it was, posted a clip here and I found this 4-disc set going for a silly price on Amazon:



I've a few things lined up for listening to this evening - the new Zinman Mahler 4 for one - but I shall try to fit The Knot Garden in too!
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George Garnett
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« Reply #544 on: 18:36:27, 19-04-2008 »

         

... amateur adolescents ...
 Wink
« Last Edit: 18:38:08, 19-04-2008 by George Garnett » Logged
martle
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« Reply #545 on: 18:48:16, 19-04-2008 »

Hmmm. Thinks. I wonder if Martle left it out deliberately and I have tumbled clumsily if innocently into the warm embrace of his capacious trap. 

As if, George! The very thought!



Actually, there were loads of Tempest possibly-operas in the 17thC, and I didn't do enough whiling to get 'em all.
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #546 on: 00:24:47, 20-04-2008 »




I've a few things lined up for listening to this evening - the new Zinman Mahler 4 for one - but I shall try to fit The Knot Garden in too!

I did have a listen to this later on and enjoyed it, especially the Labyrinth with all its comings and goings. Reading some online reviews of recent productions (Scottish Opera and the Linbury) I see that some people find it dated (What was radical 35 years ago now seems dated and occasionally dubious - Tim Ashley, Grauniad), but as it was premiered in the year I was born, I don't feel qualified to comment! I like the allusion to The Tempest, with its rehearsal/performance in the final act, and Mangus putting himself in the role of Prospero right from the start of the opera, almost moving/ controlling the characters as if they were the chess pieces which feature in the charade.

More operas based on the same plot/ source, but only in pairs this time:

Puccini and Leoncavallo: La bohème - I have heard the Leoncavallo version as well and understand that it is more closely based on La Vie de Bohème by Henri Murger than Puccini's is. Anyone going to stand up for the Leoncavallo?

Mozart and Gazzaniga: Don Giovanni (although I suppose we could add Dargomyzhsky's The Stone Guest, based on the Pushkin drama written after he saw the Mozart opera).

Paisiello and Rossini: Il Barbiere di Siviglia

Anyone know the Gazzaniga or Paisiello? Worth hearing?

It has a bigger cast, a quarter of the humour and a tiny fraction of the inspiration. (The opening to a review of the Gazzaniga, comparing it to the Mozart... Undecided)
« Last Edit: 00:39:41, 20-04-2008 by Il Grande Inquisitor » Logged

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Tony Watson
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« Reply #547 on: 00:41:14, 20-04-2008 »

Apologies if this has already been mentioned, but on the subject of duplicates:

Beethoven had to call his opera Fidelio because Paer had already written one called Leonora, and for La Clemenza di Tito Mozart used a libretto that had already been used by other composers.
« Last Edit: 00:50:36, 20-04-2008 by Tony Watson » Logged
Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #548 on: 01:23:32, 20-04-2008 »

After The Tempest, continuing on a Shakespearean note, there are several Falstaff operas: Salieri’s Falstaff, ossia Le tre burle , Nicolai’s Die lustigen Weiber von Windsor, Vaughan Williams’ Sir John in Love, Holst’s At the Boar’s Head, Verdi’s Falstaff. The only one I don’t know is the Salieri, although there have been at least three recordings. Verdi’s comedy is matchless and is usually regarded as the Shakespearean opera where he outdoes the Bard himself. I’m very fond of the RVW, however, especially after seeing it staged so well at ENO. I'm sure the Holst would make a good half of a double bill.

Othello has operatic versions by Rossini and Verdi, the former set entirely in Venice, the latter entirely on Cyprus. The Rossini has some very fine music (and four tenor roles) but there are some things which just jar about the plot – the handkerchief becomes a love-letter, Desdemona is stabbed, Emilia is not Iago’s wife. I find the characterisation in Verdi so much greater and the decision to ditch the Venetian portion of the play means he opens up with that great storm.

Now, there must be other multiple operas based on the Bard for you to be going on with?  Wink
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #549 on: 08:47:35, 20-04-2008 »

On the subject of mere duplicates presumably the luckless Manfred Gurlitt has been mentioned. He wrote a Wozzeck in 1926 and a Die Soldaten in 1930. Of course Wozzeck and Die Soldaten are two of the most world-changing operas ever. But not his ones...  Sad
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #550 on: 09:29:12, 20-04-2008 »

Now, there must be other multiple operas based on the Bard for you to be going on with?  Wink


Romeo and Juliet.  For starters there's Gounod, R&J, Bellini I Capuleti e i Montecchi and Bernstein West Side Story.

Bernstein's got more tunes.
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #551 on: 09:44:47, 20-04-2008 »

(and Prokofiev more again but that's a ballet...)
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #552 on: 13:07:50, 20-04-2008 »

I know Purcell did not set a word of Shakespeare in his The Fairy Queen, but it is based on A Midsummer Night's Dream * as more comprehensively set by Britten.

* Or at any rate sets scenes to be interpolated into a performance.  The words are less awful than Dido, (Dryden was a competent Poet Laureate) but they are no great shakes, and again Purcell triumphs with wonderful music.  If love's a sweet passion is drooly.
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #553 on: 14:53:58, 20-04-2008 »

And any other Fall of Troy operas?

Errrm, surely Dido was the Queen of Carthage (Marlowe thought so, and he was a pretty smart private detective) = modern Tunisia, whereas Troy's whereabouts were (allowing for a bit of academic leeway) in present-day Anatolia?   I agree the story is very similar, despite the disparity of location Smiley

But on the topic of Trojan operas, R Strauss's "Ägyptische Helena" (The Egyptian Helen) fits the bill nicely*, although it picks up its tale shortly after the sacking of Troy, with Menelaus already on his way home.   Another would be Tippett's KING PRIAM, one of my personal "greatest operas of the C20th".  (The Nick Hytner production for Kent Opera has recently appeared on DVD, a startling piece of work by any standards).  Although it leaves me cold, TROILUS & CRESSIDA is another card in my hand that I'll throw down, even for no points.  Worth rather more - to me, at least - Offenbach's LA BELLE HELENE is a magnificent spoof on the entire Trojan debacle
 Smiley

* edit: EGYPTIAN HELEN is worth mentioning in the Opera Quiz,  for the shortest of possible rounds: Q "Mention operas which include singing sea-shells"  A: "EGYPTIAN HELEN, ten points to Reiner Torheir for the correct answer".

re-edit and immediately lose ten points for spelling your own name wrong.
« Last Edit: 15:21:14, 20-04-2008 by Reiner Torheit » Logged

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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #554 on: 15:17:11, 20-04-2008 »


Mozart and Gazzaniga: Don Giovanni (although I suppose we could add Dargomyzhsky's The Stone Guest, based on the Pushkin drama written after he saw the Mozart opera).

Dargomyzhsky is worth including, certainly.  I've seen it staged (very, very badly) at the Bolshoi, and despite the ham-fistedness of their production there's good music in the score.  Sadly it's mainly known in the annals of spoof for the "PDQ Bach" piece "The Stoned Guest".  Also worth adding to "Giovanni" lists...    in Janacek's HOUSE OF THE DEAD, the convicts perform an opera-within-an-opera, "The Opera of Don Juan & Kedril" as an intermezzo within the piece.  And we shouldn't forget (as if I would let you!) that THE ROCKY HORROR SHOW is also the Don Juan story, cast as follows:

Don Juan - Frank'n'Furter
Leporello - Riff-Raff  (who gains an accomplice in a sister new to the plot, Magenta)
Commendatore - Dr (Von) Scott
Donna Anna - Janet Weiss
Ottavio - Brad Majors
Zerlina - Columbia
Elvira - Rocky
Masetto - Eddie (although he, too, has been previously seduced by Frank - he attempts revenge and is murdered in Act One)


Quote
Paisiello and Rossini: Il Barbiere di Siviglia
Anyone know the Gazzaniga or Paisiello? Worth hearing?


The Paisiello was written for St Petersburg, where Paisiello had secured an engagement for a magnificent fee.  It's still occasionally done in Russia (largely from a sense of it being "ours") and it's in rep at the Pokrovsky Theatre (whose musical reputation I've questioned already further above).  There is some very nice music in it - Figaro has an elegant serenade to his own guitar accompaniment, and the ensembles are well-written.  Although it's slightly contrived, there's an amusing Sneezing Trio Smiley
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
-  Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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