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The Radio 3 Boards > The Music Boards > The Opera House > Birtwistle's Punch and Judy
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Author Topic: Birtwistle's Punch and Judy  (Read 270 times)
trained-pianist
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Posts: 5455
« on: 20:16:59, 21-06-2008 »
This is my first exposure to music of Birtwistle. I am still listening to the opera on radio 3 and I like it.
I find the plot shocking. There is no punishment for bad actions, but reward. I probably would find it difficult to accept when I was younger. Now I think it reflects our world.

I find music is like recitative and expresses the phychology of characters well. I really like the music.
Does anyone listen to the opera? 
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Stanley Stewart
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Well...it was 1935
« Reply #1 on: 20:51:45, 21-06-2008 »
  Yes, t-p, I was also gripped by tonight's broadcast on R3 and I still recall the furore when Birtwistle's chamber opera was seen at the Drill Hall, in London, in 1968.    A few years earlier, we'd had the 'banning' brigade out in force when Edward Bond's 'Saved' was staged at the Royal Court theatre, involving the stoning to death of a baby and the author brought the theme of violence to the fore.

'Punch & Judy' still disturbs but it has been an extraordinary experience to hear it again after a recent R3 broadcast of 'The Minotaur', followed by the unexpected TV transmission on BBC 2 soon afterwards.  This enhanced the work for me and I have a feeling that 'Punch & July' may also have been filmed.   I couldn't understand why BBC 2 took the risk of an early evening transmission, on a Saturday evening, until I realised that World Cup footie was also underway on other TV channels so perhaps the BBC decided it was also a good time to fulfil their remit on public broadcasting on the arts, on a main channel, to get it out of the way!  Neverthess, it was still our gain as it was an enthralling production.  Did you see it, across the water?
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Don Basilio
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Era solo un mio sospetto
« Reply #2 on: 21:06:02, 21-06-2008 »
I saw it at the Young Vic in April, and theatrically it worked wonderfully.

Bear in mind the plot is no more intrinsically shocking than the children's puppet show than I saw on the beach of my home town when I was seven or eight.

The ending is a celebration of the union of man and woman, (although the man has murdered his first wife and baby first) and no-one has ever suggested that this work is undercutting that happy ending.

It is a funny work, but I am so glad I saw it at the Young Vic with the excellent Andrew Shore mugging it up for all he was worth.

Here is a review by a regular board member:

http://www.operatoday.com/content/2008/05/eno_has_one_par.php

I was there that evening with Ruth, and I can agree with her, although she has picked up lots of things that passed me by.
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
trained-pianist
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« Reply #3 on: 21:19:49, 21-06-2008 »
Thank you Stanley Stewart and Don Basilio for your posts.

I agree with Ruth Elleson description: Birtwistle’s score is usually subtle and understated, atonal but far from tuneless.

Should we take characters as puppet show and not real characters?

I am waiting for the opera to be available on Listen again.
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JimD
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« Reply #4 on: 21:28:26, 21-06-2008 »
I fear your wait will be fruitless, trained-pianist, as they rarely are: indeed never, in my limited experience.

I wonder whether anyone can comment authoritatively on the accuracy of the story of Britten walking out of a (the first?) performance of Punch and Judy.
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Don Basilio
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Era solo un mio sospetto
« Reply #5 on: 21:40:56, 21-06-2008 »
Quote from: JimD on 21:28:26, 21-06-2008
I wonder whether anyone can comment authoritatively on the accuracy of the story of Britten walking out of a (the first?) performance of Punch and Judy.

Well the story is in my beloved Viking Opera Guide, but I was told by an extremely informed authority that he has severe doubts about it.

To quote my favourite poet

View him with jealous yet suspicious eyes
And hate for arts that caused himself to rise.
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
Peter Grimes
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« Reply #6 on: 11:23:55, 26-06-2008 »
Anthony Holden repeats the story in the Guardian:

http://music.guardian.co.uk/classical/operalivereviews/story/0,,2276459,00.html
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JimD
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« Reply #7 on: 19:30:47, 26-06-2008 »
Thank you, but, as I think you both imply, this sounds like the sort of story that might have been passed from hand to hand, and become progressively more distant from something resembling the truth.  For some reason I would like to hear the tale from a knowledgeable bystander. 
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