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Author Topic: Fille du Regiment  (Read 536 times)
JeanHartrick
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Posts: 41


« on: 21:31:07, 18-04-2007 »

Just happened to be passing through Vienna last Monday and there it was, complete with JDF and ND! But instead of Dawn French we got Monserrat Caballe who probably had a rather different take on the role. 

She must have done some adlibbing, because some of it didn't appear in the surtitles in any language. She even sang a bit, a sort of lumbering folksong - sending herself up something rotten - but she doesn't care, does she?

(Actually I did enjoy it v. much at Buxton too, even with a chorus of only six, and no invading tank in the last act.  What did you think, Fosco?)
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #1 on: 21:42:17, 18-04-2007 »

Hello Jean, glad to see you again.  I look forward to hearing your trenchant comments in future.

I remember M Caballe in a production of Il viaggio a Reims years ago at ROH  (Supposedly put on by David Mellor, remember  him?, to mark his boss John Major, remember him Huh, being Chair of the EU)  She vamped like crazy.  Bless her.
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
Soundwave
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« Reply #2 on: 16:57:35, 19-04-2007 »

Ho Jean.  I posted my thoughts on the Buxton La Fille du Regiment - an opera I know extremely well - on the Grumpy Old Rant Room thread a day after the performance.  Here it is.  I do hope that it doesn't annoy you too much.
Cheers and regards.
S'wave
"Haa!.  I've never before encountered a lovely comic opera (La Fille du Regiment) turned into a pantomime from the moment the first body appeared on the boards.  No brass in the orchestra but there was a A PIANO!  The gallant regiment of French soldiers consisted of 3 men dressed in cheap costumes.  Their hats, and the hats of the four frightened (haa!) village girls were cut out pieces of what appeared to be thick illustrated cardboard, attached vertically to their foreheads with elastic or tape round the back of their heads.  From the side and back, the effect was ludicrous.  I could, perhaps, have understood it if they had been completely dressed as playing cards.  Some of the actions and movements were pure pantomime.  The sop was o.k. but tended to be somewhat gusty.  The tenor, quite a nice singer, but I expected a clearer, more ringing and less softly throaty voice.  Sergeant Sulpice had a good voice and played his part well.  The lady who played the small speaking part of the Duchesse de Krakenthorp  (oddly a small village in Cumbria) had obviously given no thought to the character at all and her part just fell by the wayside - wasted.  The sops mother appeared about the same age as her daughter.  I just cannot understand why any small company would attempt an opera that has a good deal of chorus work involving soldiers, villagers etc in fair numbers.  The minimum chorus, even for a small company, should be 5 of each voice.   Patrons:- Dennis O'Neill!!!.  Robert Lloyd!!!  Josephine Veasey!!!  Ryland Davies!!!  There was an article in the programme by the Chairman of The Donizetti Society!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Phew!
All in all, quite the worst overall performance of an opera I've ever seen.  Rant over.  Runs for cover with ducks behind sofa."
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Ho! I may be old yet I am still lusty
JeanHartrick
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Posts: 41


« Reply #3 on: 12:15:36, 22-04-2007 »

Thank you for reposting that, Soundwave - I didn't see it the first time.  I'm still having difficulty finding my way around this board.

Having read it I feel rather ashamed of myself.  Did I really enjoy the Swansea City opera production?  Was I just determined to enjoy it because I never imagined I would see the other? I still think that the voices of the two principals (Michaela Bloom and Brendan MacBride) were good enough for enjoyment not to have been a totally unreasonable reaction.  Brendan Wheatley, who played Sulpice, was co-founder of the company as Opera Box. 

It does open the question of what minimum resources are required for a production of any particular opera.  Aida with such forces would be ridiculous, but I thought they just about got away with it here.

I do however have an abiding feeling of guilt that in starting the thread, I induced you to undergo this terrible experience...I can only apologise!     
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harpy128
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Posts: 298


« Reply #4 on: 13:30:58, 22-04-2007 »

Soundwave's account  makes me quite wish I'd seen it...it sounds a hoot, and minimal productions are fine by me, provided the singing is acceptable of course.

I'm sure I read that when they were first written Donizetti's operas would have been put on by travelling companies (presumably with limited resources)? So perhaps there's a case for doing it on a shoestring. I did enjoy the ROH production but it seemed a bit OTT in some ways.
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #5 on: 14:10:22, 22-04-2007 »

Jean, for goodness sake don't feel guilty.

As I remember from the Other Place, it was Reiner who advised going to see it and commenting that it would have been put on by traveling players in its days, the Italian equivalent of Mr Crummles' theatrical troupe.

And for Pete's sake, by all accounts La fille is not a work of high seriousness.

And I bet lots of people would never have experienced it at all if it had not been put on at Buxton.  What is the price differential between Buxton and the ROH I wonder?  I suspect on any given night a high proportion of seats at the ROH are used for corporate entertainment by people who are not attending primarily out of love of operatic art.

I hope Juan Diego records the piece on CD.  I have his Ah mes amis on one of his compilation CDs, but I would love to hear the lot (preferably with M Caballe rather than the Vicar of Dibley.)
« Last Edit: 19:41:04, 23-04-2007 by Donbasilio » Logged

To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
harpy128
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Posts: 298


« Reply #6 on: 14:15:56, 22-04-2007 »

Quote
As I remember from the Other Place, it was Reiner who advised going to see it and commenting that it would have been put on by traveling players in its days, the Italian equivalent of Mr Crummles' theatrical troupe.



Yes, perhaps that's where I read it Smiley
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Soundwave
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« Reply #7 on: 14:47:08, 22-04-2007 »

Ho Jean.  There's certainly no need to apologise or feel ashamed or anything.  If you enjoyed it, that is fine and dandy, and most certainly you shouldn't feel guilty in any way.  When I said I knew the work well it was because, many years ago in my young days, before my voice grew heavier and darker, I sang Tonio in two different productions.  The tenor role is not an easy one but does require a fair amount of real zip and liveliness.  Brendan MacBride made a pretty good job of it but seemed to lack attachment and intensity in his feelings.  Michaela Bloom I felt was somewhat gusty.  My wife (a former soprano) liked her but also commented on the gustiness.  One thing that annoyed me intensely, in the first 15 minutes of the opera, was the astoundingly loud, strange sounding percussion that sometimes obliterated all other sounds.
As you may surmise, I felt it was certainly not the right choice for a company of this size with such limited forces.   A few years ago I saw, in Carlisle, the English Touring Opera (I'm pretty sure it was them) give an excellent performance with fine principals and sufficient chorus to make things work.  Try to see it if it's still around.   You may feel that I could be somewhat biased here.  I really do try not to be - but can I tell?
Cheers.
« Last Edit: 14:52:47, 22-04-2007 by Soundwave » Logged

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Soundwave
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« Reply #8 on: 15:19:11, 22-04-2007 »

Ho Don Basilio.  I'm not so sure about the "travelling players".   The first performance was at L’Opéra-Comique.  Marie's have included, amongst others, Alboni, Jenny Lind, Sonntag as well as quite a few sopranos of the last 100 years and the idea that small Mr Crummles Theatrical Groups travelling companies could manage Tonios and Maries is, I think, very suspect.   La Fille is not an opera of "high seriousness" but the singing is very serious indeed.  I've never been convinced that anything "poor" in the theatre is conducive to people being likely to become fans.
Cheers
« Last Edit: 15:24:00, 22-04-2007 by Soundwave » Logged

Ho! I may be old yet I am still lusty
Don Basilio
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« Reply #9 on: 21:59:35, 22-04-2007 »

Soundwave

Thanks for the clarification.  I am sure Reiner mentioned touring comnpanies: the Crummeles notion was my literary spin.  Inappropriate in this case.  Poor singing will never produce a love of opera.  On the other hand, in the age of recorded sound we are getting very near to talking as if only Callas can sing Norma, or only Florez can sing Tonio, only Schwarzkopf can sing the Marschellin and so on.

And I totally overlooked the fact La fille is French not Italian.  Does that make a major difference to the style of the music, in your opinion?

All the best
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
Soundwave
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« Reply #10 on: 16:54:59, 23-04-2007 »

Ho Don Basilio.  Language does indeed make a difference to musical vocal style.  Composers seem to draw on the sound quality of words for inspiration, particularly for melody and vocal phrasing and I think that most translations don't lie on the vocal line as well as the original language used by the composer.  There is also the question of the number of syllables.   Even in vocal range, the language makes a difference. French, for a tenor, is pretty good at the high end of the range - the "top C" in the Faust aria is a particularly good example - and a high "ee" vowel (as, for example, in mes ami) is conducive to a good mixed tone.  The vocal sound of the Italian version of La Fille is not a patch on the original.  Lina Pagliughi made a recording for Cetra, years ago, and, if you can find a copy I'm sure you'll agree.   If you look at Italian, French, German, Russian song, the styles, melodies and phrases are really bound up with the language.  French song translated into German is surely a no-no, although Erlkonig translated into French might be interesting.
May I suggest that you might find it illuminating to listen to one song each by, say, Schubert, Faure, Rachmaninov, Vaughan Williams and Granados.   
Cheers and regards.
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Ho! I may be old yet I am still lusty
Don Basilio
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Era solo un mio sospetto


« Reply #11 on: 18:32:32, 23-04-2007 »

Thanks a lot, Soundwave, I'll try that on the ipod. I'm sure there's a difference.

In the early hours of the morning recently I got up with a raging toothache to make myself and sip some chamomile tea (as recommended by Beatrix Potter - since you're in Cumbria you must know the literary reference) and I turned on Radio 3.  To my surprise, they played some lieder in Dutch by a Dutch composer.  The pain in my jaw and the hour of night have lead to me completely forgetting who it was.  He was a friend of some better known composer who has also slipped my mind.  It certainly sounded different from German.

(My tooth is better, thank you.  Now I have given up wine, the anti biotic appears to be working.)

Can you say "lieder" for non-German songs?  Is "art song" too precious as a description?

Do you prefer Don Carlos/Carlo in Italian or French?
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
Soundwave
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Gender: Male
Posts: 572



« Reply #12 on: 19:38:24, 23-04-2007 »

Ho Don B.  As you will know, lied/lieder is German for song/songs and is used only in that context.  I have to say though that I have encountered it in descriptions of some Grieg songs and others where the text was in German.  Personally I like the term "art song" to distinguish "quality" non-German songs from ballads and drawing room ditties.   Regretfully, I'm not aware of any Dutch songs and have only encountered a couple of composers.  My friend in Friesland doesn't sound German and, interestingly, told me that Friesian and Norfolk fishermen meeting in the North Sea can understand each other very well.  Hm!

Glad to hear your tooth is better.  They can be a real painful nuisance at times.  The idea of giving up wine though, is totally disturbing and I may not now sleep tonight.  As a punishment for you mentioning the horrible chamomile tea, you are condemned to visit Potter's house in the next five months.
Cheers
p.s. prefer it in French.
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Ho! I may be old yet I am still lusty
Don Basilio
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Gender: Male
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Era solo un mio sospetto


« Reply #13 on: 19:49:54, 23-04-2007 »

In the wee small hours of Saturday I heard:
5.32am
Verhulst, Johannes (1816-1891): Lied van bloemen, Op 26 No 2
5.35am
Herinnering, Op 26 No 12
5.38am
Minneliedje, Op 27 No 9
Nico van der Meel (tenor)
Leo van Doeselaar (fortepiano)

For reasons stated above, I was not that receptive.

I understand from the National Trust website that Miss Potter's house, (even before inclusion in a Major Motion Picture) was so popular, that they would rather punters just experience it on line, rather than overcrowd the place.

Incidentally I think the NT tries to theme its cafe, so at the Rothschild's Waddesdon Manor you get fine clarets, ditto at Churchill's Chartwell.  At Sutton Hoo, by contrast you were offered some unpleasant supposedly Anglo Saxon lentil mush with mead.

I imagine at Hilltop, they offer chamomile tea and blackberries.

Who is the odd one out in literary terms Karl Marx, Joseph Stalin, Beatrix Potter or Trotsky?
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
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