Neatly put, sir - although I imagine that such computer science lecturers would almost certainly travel by public omnibus (if they can find any such in the north of Bristol) rather than the even more expensive taxi, especially since the former mode of transport will be driven by an employee (albeit an exploited working-class one) but the latter by one of those dreadful self-employed business-owning members of the private enterprise set...

Best,

Alistair

I don't remember sneering at improving education but I do get blackouts occasionally.

It was this sort of stuff I was wrinkling my nose at :


[Sorry, for the avoidance of doubt that's Gordon Downie, not Ian, though it so happens he was talking to Ian when he said it.] 

Me? No, none at all. It's this idea that there's a particularly inadequate and backward group called 'working people' who need to have this done 'to' them by some elite of, presumably, 'non-working people' and aren't perfectly capable of doing it for themselves  -  that's the bit that sticks in my craw, wherever that might be. Elsewhere in that same discussion Downie uses the word 'retarded' when describing the sort of music that these poor inadequates seem to like. That had a bumpy ride down the craw too.

Incidentally, while I cheerfully disagree with a great deal of it, I hope Ian won't mind me saying that his extended conversation with Gordon Downie is extremely interesting, for those who are interested in this sort of thing . Here: http://www.musicalpointers.co.uk/articles/generaltopics/DowniePace.htm A few pictures of Janine Jansen would have brightened it up but you can't have everything.

[Yes, agree. This isn't really the right thread.]

I do have to award you full Marx for consistency, Ian, even if for little else here.

Whatever money any currently working politicians may or may not be prepared to invest (and remember that it's not their money as such in any case) in "decent education" (which, for the record, I do of course regard as an "important thing"), I would have thought that your democratic views might have persuaded even you that such education is deserved by people of all classes rather than just the one, but maybe I'm wrong about that - and/or maybe you feel that people who can afford to pay for private education (either directly out of their incomes or out of school fees planning) should have no right to state education for their offspring, or maybe I'm wrong about that, too....

If I get "worked up" about "raising taxes" (regardless of who is doing it), has it not occurred to you that I may be concerned that there's precious little point in raising tax rates and inventing new taxes if the majority of people simply cannot afford to pay them; taxes are already very high in UK and, if they get much higher, some people will increase their efforts to evade them but many more may well find themselves unable to avoid defaulting on them.

By "European levels" you refer, of course, to mainland Europe. I would be the first to agree that a substantial part of the French rail network and the national health services of France and Spain put ours rather to shame, yet do the French and the Spanish pay vastly higher taxes than we do in UK? I don't think so - at least not on average. Furthermore, many French and some Spanish people do not believe that the success of such flagship state services can be expected to last much longer, because there is simply not the money there to pay for it. As I mentioned before, it's no more use expecting the average taxpayer to go on forking out more and more if he/she simply doesn't have the wherewithal to meet such commitments than it is to sue someone who has no money.

For the record, I do not keep the company of economists of any wing or none, nor do I have reason or desire to do so; those are not the kinds of circles in which I move. I do recognise, however, that you did at least use the word "perhaps" in your remark here...

I have never said or written that "democracy is bad". I also do not sneer at public transport as such. Do bear in mind, however, that almost all "public" transport is run and owned by private companies and, given that hardly any such companies could ever hope to derive a profit from fare-paying customers alone (any more than a classical concert promoter could expect to derive one from box office receipts alone), they rely on subsidies from the taxpayer to help keep their shareholders happy. Do also bear in mind that, in principle, "public transport" in UK includes licensed taxis and air services, of the latter of which we have far more domestic coverage than was once the case (a fact that certain environmentalists conveniently choose to overlook when on their "public transport good, private transport bad" soapboxes).

Once again, Ian, you seem still to be developing yuour curious obsession to seel to act as some kind of political mouthpiece for me, which I do not at all appreciate because (a) I can and would far rather speak for myself and (b) you are insufficiently clear about your facts to enable you to do this and can we now PLEASE get away from taxis and taxes and bac to Jac? Surely the only new labour we should be pondering in this thread is that which David Matthews may at some point contemplate investing in the composition of a seventh symphony? Would you like to put your own soap back in its box and tell us what you thought of the Prom, Ian?

Best,

Alistair

I am largely in agreement with you here.

I have read it some time ago and yes, it is indeed interesting (if abit wearing, overlong and, on the GD side, rather heavily fundamentalist, proselytising and constrictive in places); I have now tried to imagine it illustrated by photos of Janine Jansen with or without her violin and in various states and amounts of sartorial diaphony (apologies to her compatriot Bernard van Dieren for the use of that term here), but have found my composerly imagination sadly wanting here - indeed, I cannot even quite get my head around the idea of including a pic or two of Ms Jansen performing a violin and piano work by GD with Ian at the piano and GD page-turning in the context of that discussion. Ah, well...

I agree, too - but it IS the right thread for discussion of that Prom, so let's have some of that, please!...

Best,

Alistair

I've just heard the last bit of the Prokofiev on the rebroadcast (which started at at 2.00.)

I didn't bother listening the first time round, 'cos of all the hype from a certain poet.

But La Jansen really can play - I love her tone, vibrato, phrasing, etc.  A really top class performance.

Now I don't know whether to be grumpy, sad, or happy.

Tommo