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Author Topic: Roman Haubenstock-Ramati  (Read 2309 times)
Chafing Dish
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« Reply #75 on: 03:24:52, 12-05-2007 »

I really like December '52 even though most performances I've heard seem to be postulated on obvious "mappings" (Cartesian time/pitch relationship, etc.).  I'd also suggest that the score should be presented, somehow, to the audience when it appears on a program; grasping the performers' response to the challenge of "composing" a method to realize the score is, for me, one of the coolest things about hearing the piece.

Welcome, Colin!  Nice to see you here.  (I hope all these American midwesterners don't chase away all the people who actually, um, listen to Radio 3!)
I am not a Mid-westerner. I just live here. Ditto Colin.
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TimR-J
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« Reply #76 on: 10:45:34, 12-05-2007 »

Actually, the score is not specifically meant to be read from left to right, top to bottom, or anything else along those lines (though it certainly could be, these are only a few of the many, many options).  I'll quote from the prefatory note to Folio (which includes Dec '52 and several other similar-ish works), which includes misc. extracts from Brown's sketchbook from late 1952 ...

"... to have elements exist in space ... space as an infinitude of directions from an infinitude of points in space ... to work (compositionally and in performance) to right, left, back, forward, up, down, and all points between ... the score [being] a picture of this space at one instant, which must always be considered as unreal and/or transitory ... a performer must set this all in motion (time), which is to say, realize that it is in motion and step into it ... either sit and let it move or move through it at all speeds."

"[coefficient of] intensity and duration [is] space forward and back."

"The composition may be performed in any direction from any point in the defined space for any length of time and may be performed from any of the four rotational positions in any sequence.  In a performance utilizing only three dimensions as active (vertical, horizontal, and time), the thickness of the event indicates the relative intensity and/or (where applicable instrumentally) clusters.  Where all four dimensions are active, the relative thickness and length of events are functions of their conceptual position on a plane perpendicular to the vertical and horizontal plane of the score. ... It is primarily intended that performances be made directly from this graphic 'implication' (one for each performer) and that no further preliminary defining of the events, other than an agreement as to total performance time, take place.  Further defining of the events is not prohibited however, provided that the imposed determinate-system is implicit in the score and in these notes."

There's also a cool little graph of a cube that I wish I could copy here, but the caption reads "space relative to conceptual mobility and transformation of events in arbitrary, unstable time."

Thanks for the clarifications Aaron. I'll admit I've never looked at Folio, so my understanding is an accumulation of other people's reports, commentaries, etc.
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aaron cassidy
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« Reply #77 on: 17:38:10, 12-05-2007 »

I am not a Mid-westerner. I just live here. Ditto Colin.

A likely story.

(For the record, I'm from Texas and New Jersey, though b/t 6 years in Chicago and, goodness, 8 (?) in Buffalo (which is midwestern-ish), maybe I'm actually turning into a proper midwesterner.  Hm.)
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Evan Johnson
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« Reply #78 on: 21:02:33, 13-05-2007 »

Thanks for the welcome.  This forum is a real find.

How many performances did Augenmusik do?  Is the group still around?

A few, mostly in Buffalo and environs but also in Boston and Montreal; and sort of, although it has morphed (after my and Aaron's absence) into the Open Music Ensemble.

We did some really good shows, though, back in the day (the day being 2003-4 or so if I recall correctly)

Oh, and while I have your attention I would like to state for the record that while I spent three years in Buffalo I quickly retreated to the East Coast so as to avoid becoming a Midwesterner beyond repair. Like Colin, I believe, I am a Marylander by birth...

actually, I love Buffalo.  But that's for another day.  And, most likely, some other more appropriate venue!
« Last Edit: 21:04:24, 13-05-2007 by Evan Johnson » Logged
Colin Holter
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« Reply #79 on: 00:36:34, 14-05-2007 »

You're from MD too, Evan?  I don't quite know what to think about you now.

I've lived in the Midwest for two years, and it vexes me to no end when I accidentally pronounce "have" with two syllables, "on" with one, etc.  The other day I found myself being nice to someone I didn't even know, if you can believe it!  I can't get out of here soon enough.

Back to the topic, though:  I think Haubenstock-Ramati's graphic scores could benefit from the same "speculative mapping" that I mentioned with respect to December '52.  Maybe there are already performers doing this.  However, I believe (although my record when it comes to unverified assertions on the Radio 3 board is not stellar) that RHR generally included fairly specific instructions with his scores.  I wonder how closely performers tend to follow them?  Maybe they should read like Beethoven's metronome indications.
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Evan Johnson
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« Reply #80 on: 14:45:08, 14-05-2007 »

You're from MD too, Evan?  I don't quite know what to think about you now.

Well, sort of.  If I recall correctly you are an actual Marylander, whereas I am from the Montgomery County
DC suburbs.  So I don't make any strong claims for Old Line authenticity.  Anyhow...

Back to the topic, though:  I think Haubenstock-Ramati's graphic scores could benefit from the same "speculative mapping" that I mentioned with respect to December '52.  Maybe there are already performers doing this.  However, I believe (although my record when it comes to unverified assertions on the Radio 3 board is not stellar) that RHR generally included fairly specific instructions with his scores.  I wonder how closely performers tend to follow them?  Maybe they should read like Beethoven's metronome indications.

They vary.  There are at least a couple pieces I know of in which, unless I'm mistaken (and AC can probably correct me), the score consists of a fairly dense graphic assemblage without further explication.  Augenmusik's contrabassoon player (yes, really) specialized in those.  But there are also others with varying levels of specificity of instruction, up to and including the pieces like Mobile for Shakespeare that are, formally, not so far from Boulez or Maderna in their approach to open form.
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