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IgnorantRockFan
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« on: 10:34:00, 15-09-2007 » |
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I really like Philip Glass  It's a bit disconcerting, after thinking I didn't like modern composers, that everything I've listen to recently I've really enjoyed. And I've obviously completely misunderstood the "minimalist" tag. Because I hear a very "full" sound with lots of different variations and harmonies within it. (So can somebody explain what minimalist really means?) I'm listening to the Naxos disc with Company/Violin Concerto/Akhnaten. The violin concerto is very dramatic and it reminds me a little of the John Adams concerto (which I also really like) so I can see they're coming from the same "school". In the first movement the soloist races through sets of arpeggios (I think that's what it's called) in a way that reminds me of modern rock guitar playing. I don't know what experts think of the style but to me it's very a stirring technique. The orchestral accompaniment is very moody and at times the sound texture makes me think it's an electronic keyboard rather than an orchestra. The violin has a very unusual (beautiful) tone in the second movement. It's a sound I would have said was an electric violin if I didn't know better. (This may be a naive comparison to the rest of you, but it seriously reminds me of the tone Vanessa-Mae achieves on her Zeta on the more moody pieces on the albums Storm and Subject to Change). Then the third movement... am I being stupid or is the main violin theme pinched from something by Vivaldi? Overall, it's a stunning piece of work. One that makes me want to play it over again as soon as it finishes (I'm on the third consecutive play as I write). I'm sorry I don't have the proper musical vocabulary to talk about it intelligently... but I really do like it  |
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Allegro, ma non tanto
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richard barrett
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« Reply #1 on: 10:53:48, 15-09-2007 » |
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"Minimalist" is generally taken to indicate music based on repetition, although Glass's work certainly does this less as time goes on, and by the time he wrote the pieces on that disc the music is a great deal less repetitive than the music he was writing in the 1960s and 70s, where typically a piece lasting 20 minutes or more would consist entirely of a single "riff" undergoing slow processes of expansion, contraction and "division" (into smaller notes), often using the same kind of pentatonic (five-note) scales which are common in rock music (inherited from blues and ultimately from African music).
I haven't heard the Glass Violin Concerto but I wouldn't be at all surprised if he uses an amplified violin. His earlier works like Music in Twelve Parts (which I like much better) were all written for his own ensemble of flutes, saxes, female voices and electronic organs, which was often amplified at quite a high level in concerts. The reference to Vivaldi may or may not be coincidental, though Glass regularly takes snippets from older music as the basis for his own, and Vivaldi would seem a likely candidate because his music also often works with repeated figurations.
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #2 on: 12:01:45, 15-09-2007 » |
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I'm sorry I don't have the proper musical vocabulary to talk about it intelligently...
I wouldn't worry about that too much... you already have talked about it intelligently, because you've given your own account of the piece, rather than relying on formulaic approaches favoured by musicologists. When music becomes the purview of a coterie of "experts" then it's lost its way badly. One of the most negative things in the world of contemporary music is the infighting, down-shouting and bullying that accompanies it - which is often far from "intelligent" or edifying, unfortunately. I'm glad you've felt comfortable exploring new stuff If you liked those, Glass's Symphonies #2 and #3 are also available on Naxos (paired on one disc), in super performances by the Bournemouth SO, conducted by Marin Alsop. You might want to round-out your experience of the "minimalists" with music by Terry Riley or Steve Reich? |
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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TimR-J
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« Reply #3 on: 12:27:10, 15-09-2007 » |
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If you like the Adams Violin Concerto, IRF, I'm sure you'll like his earlier works too. Shaker Loops is the obvious one, and even if it is over-played, I still think it's a very fine piece. I'm quite fond of this recording, which has Shaker Loops in the original version for solo strings rather than string orchestra, and it's a bit edgier as a result. It's also paired with the monster piano solo Phrygian Gates, another early piece that I love, and the later - and very different - Chamber Symphony. reminds me of modern rock guitar playing I'd never heard that connection before, but I know what you mean! |
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richard barrett
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« Reply #4 on: 12:34:40, 15-09-2007 » |
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I completely agree with Reiner.
Actually I've been listening more of late to Terry Riley, whose In C pretty much started off minimalism "as we know it", though actually it's not a very characteristic work, and I much prefer his Indian-influenced modal improvisations over drone and/or looped backgrounds as in Rainbow in Curved Air or Shri Camel. To my ears Reich has remained more interesting for longer than the other two. (His Music for 18 Musicians is a good place to start.)
Contemporary composition is a massively varied landscape, which has the disadvantage of making it difficult for anyone (even if they're involved in it) to have a comprehensive overview of what's going on, but the advantage that anyone willing to take the plunge is bound to find something that appeals to them, if they have the patience to find it.
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martle
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« Reply #5 on: 12:35:10, 15-09-2007 » |
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IRF, as Richard implies, 'minimalism' these days is a pretty broad church. The 1960s and '70s work of Glass, Reich, Riley, LaMonte Young et al is, for many, the most interesting if only because of its stance as 'experimental' music in some senses - certainly concieved as a style or movement consciously in opposition to the regular 'avant garde'. But many would then argue that the music of Glass and Reich in particular becomes soft, perhaps complacent and lazy at its worst, during the 1980s and beyond, as their fame and success grew.
Despite sharing the same minimalist roots, the younger Adams always seems to me to have been a very different kettle of fish, with so much chromatic harmony and 'traditional' syntax in his music that it's virtually neo-romantic in style. (Just seen Tim's post, and I'd agree about the quality of Shaker Loops!)
You might find some European music influenced in various ways by the USA minimalists (such as Louis Andriessen's) interesting too.
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Green. Always green.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #6 on: 12:44:27, 15-09-2007 » |
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There is various music not generally labelled 'minimalist', but which would likely appeal to those who like other minimalist music. I'd particularly recommend Hans Otte's Das Buch der Klänge in this respect (there's a recording by Herbert Henck on ECM, and another one by the composer himself on an obscure label). Not out of the question that minimalism-likers would take to Feldman, as well.
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
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Bryn
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« Reply #7 on: 12:54:53, 15-09-2007 » |
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Do check out Hear and Now tonight. Not only a fair bit of Terry Riley's music, but a recent interview with Riley, by Robert Worby.
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harmonyharmony
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« Reply #8 on: 13:19:27, 15-09-2007 » |
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I'm listening to the Naxos disc with Company/Violin Concerto/Akhnaten.
For me, the Violin Concerto is the star of that disc. I don't really like Company and I think that he does the kind of writing in the music from Akhnaten better in other pieces (particularly the last two movements of the CIVIL warS). Have you tried listening to Koyaanisqatsi? I think it comes from about the same time and it's quite a satisfying listen. I'd also recommend watching the film for which it was written, directed by Reggio. Powaqaatsi isn't as good, but it's still fun. Also, I'd heartily recommend Einstein on the Beach as a wonderful listen. No idea about how it translates to an opera house but I'd love to see it. Another favourite Glass work for me has to be Wichita Sutra Vortex with the voice of Allen Ginsberg. I can't stand the rest of Hydrogen Jukebox but there's something about the combination of the piano and voice in the number that just works. I might come back to other minimalists later, but wanted to get my Glass-oar in first. Oh yes, and I like Floe too. |
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'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
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HtoHe
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« Reply #9 on: 13:32:21, 15-09-2007 » |
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"I haven't heard the Glass Violin Concerto but I wouldn't be at all surprised if he uses an amplified violin.
I remember going to the UK Premiere of this work (Kremer/Slatkin/Philharmonia RFH 9th April 1994) and I don't remember the violin being amplified. It's possible they could have done it without my noticing but there's nothing in the programme notes to suggest it. On the contrary there is this quote from PG "I like the orchestra. I have an alternative, electronic medium, which is my ensemble. By writing for both there's a balance in my activities" It's a good piece to hear in a concert performance if you get the chance, IRF. Very dramatic, as you say. 'Hypnotic' is the word that was on my lips at the end of the performance. |
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harmonyharmony
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« Reply #10 on: 14:49:45, 15-09-2007 » |
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In the case of a recording it could be something to do with the placement of the mikes.
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'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
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ahinton
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« Reply #11 on: 19:07:46, 15-09-2007 » |
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A musicologist that I know (yes, I do know some!) calls him Philippe de Vitry; I wish I'd thought of that.
Best,
Alistair
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TimR-J
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« Reply #12 on: 11:51:40, 16-09-2007 » |
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There is various music not generally labelled 'minimalist', but which would likely appeal to those who like other minimalist music. I'd particularly recommend Hans Otte's Das Buch der Klänge in this respect (there's a recording by Herbert Henck on ECM
Seconded - that's a very pretty record. (Ian - how does the composer's recording compare, and is it worth hunting down?) |
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #13 on: 11:56:31, 16-09-2007 » |
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There is various music not generally labelled 'minimalist', but which would likely appeal to those who like other minimalist music. I'd particularly recommend Hans Otte's Das Buch der Klänge in this respect (there's a recording by Herbert Henck on ECM
Seconded - that's a very pretty record. (Ian - how does the composer's recording compare, and is it worth hunting down?) The composer's recording is very different, less 'driven' most of the time, more aloof, extremely beautiful. Worth having both, definitely worth hunting down the composer's version. It's on Kuckuck 11069-2; they were (maybe still are?) distributed in North America by Celestial Harmonies. Let me know if you have difficulty getting hold of it. Otte is probably now best known for this piece, but his early work is extremely different, overlapping with some of the music-theatre creations of Schnebel and others in the 1960s, later creating major sound-light installations (I've only ever seen pics of these, never experienced one). Also, he was one of the most important figures in helping to establish the reputation of Cage and Feldman in Germany, through his efforts at Radio Bremen, for Pro Musica Nova, and so on. Very unjustly overlooked in the history of post-war music. |
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #14 on: 15:16:09, 16-09-2007 » |
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Very unjustly overlooked in the history of post-war music.
Which of his pieces would you recommend? I don't know anything of his work at all. For professional reasons I am more interested in music-theatre and "performance" pieces, but I am open to anything that's good Obviously disks that are currently available would be ideal... I don't have access to any remotely comprehensive sound archives here. |
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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