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Author Topic: who was Shostakovich?  (Read 25287 times)
Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #75 on: 09:19:54, 31-03-2007 »

It's funny what tricks the mind can play...some sections were very fast and others 'ponderous' and heavy; overall, it clocked in a minute or two faster than his recording, but at exactly the same time as Boulez's Cleveland recording which is the one I assume Alison was recommending at the other place....I discovered I had this in my collection this morning(!) - part of the DG Centenary edition which I think I'd originally bought for the Debussy it was coupled with - so I shall give it a spin later today.

I haven't heard any of the Maxim Shostakovich cycle, and can't recall having read any reviews - I'll have to double check IRR and Gramophone.
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Bryn
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« Reply #76 on: 18:19:08, 31-03-2007 »

The latest 'flyer' from "The Classical Music Group" arrived today. I note that the Warner Shatakovich/Rostropovich symphonies set is being/has been reissues at a very reasonable priced, (around £24 for the complete symphonies).  The catalogue number is 2564 641772.
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #77 on: 19:58:21, 05-04-2007 »

I see that Edward Seckerson is joining Andrew McGregor to discuss the Melodiya Kondrashin set on Saturday's CD Review (no indication of what time though).

Has anybody seen the Larry Weinstein film 'Shostakovich against Stalin'? I watched it yesterday and whilst its analysis of the symphonies 4-9 is quite brief, it has some fascinating archive footage, plus interviews with colleagues (including Ilya Musin) and family - his daughter, Galina.
« Last Edit: 13:43:02, 06-04-2007 by Il Grande Inquisitor » Logged

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trained-pianist
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« Reply #78 on: 20:21:30, 05-04-2007 »

IGI, I did not see it and I did not know about the film. Is it DVD? I read Volkov's book about Schostakovich. What else could be said about Schostakovich. I feel they have said everything already about him. Or should I buy it if it is DVD.
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #79 on: 20:29:06, 05-04-2007 »

Yes, t-p, it's on DVD. It also contains some movements from Gergiev's cycle of the 'War Symphonies' on audio/ surround sound.
The film is very moving, especially the interviews with people from St Petersburg/Leningrad about their experiences in WW2 and the terrible food shortages.

There were several Shostakovich quotes read over the footage which, as I suspected, turned out to be from the Volkov book, which I'm ashamed to say I have not yet read.
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Ian Pace
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« Reply #80 on: 20:31:46, 05-04-2007 »

IGI, I did not see it and I did not know about the film. Is it DVD? I read Volkov's book about Schostakovich. What else could be said about Schostakovich. I feel they have said everything already about him. Or should I buy it if it is DVD.

Do you mean Testimony or Volkov's book on Shostakovich and Stalin? The authenticity of Testimony has been challenged by several scholars, most prominently Laurel Fay and Richard Taruskin. More can be read at the following:

http://www.siue.edu/~aho/musov/deb/begin.html
http://context.themoscowtimes.com/print.php?aid=135412
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2000/apr2000/shos-a07.shtml
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #81 on: 20:34:23, 05-04-2007 »

Certainly the quotes read on the DVD were from Testimony.

Some fascinating reading there, Ian. Thanks for posting those links. The Elizabeth Wilson book looks worth reading as does the Ian MacDonald. I'm sure I've seen Shostakovich: A Life Remembered recommended somewhere before.
« Last Edit: 20:50:36, 05-04-2007 by Il Grande Inquisitor » Logged

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trained-pianist
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« Reply #82 on: 21:25:51, 05-04-2007 »

It is fascinating discussion. I was too far from musicology for a long time to know about this debate.
I can say that I was surprised by many things when I read Volkov's book, though many things sound like true. I accepted the book. I think Shostakovich did not authorize it. Perhaps they had many conversations and Volkov new Shostakovich well.
Most inteligenzia in the USSR were not dissidents, but hidden dissidents. During Stalin's time people were afraid. I new Brezhnev time when people were not as afraid and they talked to each other more frankly.
I knew people who went through Stalin's time and they were scared for life and very very afraid.
Music of Schostakovich speak to us because many of us have to compromise in life in order to survive and succeed.
I always thought while in Russia that Schostakovich was officially sanctioned composer.
Bach and Mozart and Beethoven had to compromise. Bach wrote very submissive letters (as was done in his days when writing to high standing noble gentlemen). They all maintained their dignity and sometimes lost patience.
Shostakovich showed Soviet official nose (like clown) behind their backs, everybody did it.
Rostropovich was exception in supporting openly Solzhenizyn, but he took calculated risk, because at that time they did not kill people, but threw them out of the county.
Many people did that at a time (especially if they wanted to leave). Shostakovich did not want to leave. He felt very Russian and Western things were strange to him. I know many old style sovieticus people who could not accept West (compromise, commercialism etc, they only understood black and white, right or wrong and no shades).

Please forgive me for the long message with lots of mistakes in it I am sure. I am beginning to think aloud or reminisce.
tp


« Last Edit: 22:01:57, 05-04-2007 by trained-pianist » Logged
Bryn
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« Reply #83 on: 21:39:01, 05-04-2007 »


Please forgive me for the long message with lots of mistakes in it I am sure. I am beginning to think aloud or reminisce.
tp

Your sense was very clear indeed, thank you, tp.
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martle
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« Reply #84 on: 22:59:15, 05-04-2007 »

Yes, t-p - a very clear and moving post. Thankyou.
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Green. Always green.
Ian Pace
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« Reply #85 on: 23:17:11, 05-04-2007 »

Agree absolutely with Bryn and martle - it was an extremely moving and very interesting post. Please do post at any time, and at any length you like, about this subject and your experiences, t-p - it is fascinating and highly thought-provoking to read.
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'These acts of keeping politics out of music, however, do not prevent musicology from being a political act . . .they assure that every apolitical act assumes a greater political immediacy' - Philip Bohlman, 'Musicology as a Political Act'
lovedaydewfall
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« Reply #86 on: 16:29:03, 06-04-2007 »

Stravinsky and Furtwängler[

I am looking now with suspicion in his eyes. Do people have any comments?



/////////////////////<<<<<<<<<<<<Yes - Shos. looks a bit like Harry Potter!
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Il Grande Inquisitor
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« Reply #87 on: 23:59:48, 06-04-2007 »

I see that Edward Seckerson is joining Andrew McGregor to discuss the Melodiya Kondrashin set on Saturday's CD Review (no indication of what time though).


Although I now see that the R3 site has this listed for both the 7th and the 14th April so it might not be tomorrow!
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #88 on: 08:22:19, 07-04-2007 »

No mention of it in RT for today, Mark, (not that means anything much).

 Apologies to anyone waiting for the notes on 4 iii; it may take a little while yet, particularly as I'm becoming very intererested in a particular motivic shape which opens the abandoned sketch for the symphony, and which, even despite its obvious omission from the finished work in its ur-form, nevertheless appears to be having a major influence on the shape of other motives not only in all three movements of this piece but crucially also its immediate symphonic successor...
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richard barrett
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« Reply #89 on: 10:03:58, 07-04-2007 »

This is most intriguing, Ron. Unfortunately my peripatetic lifestyle at the moment has caused me to be in a different country from my copy of the CD of said preliminary version, which I hadn't got round to listening to. The more I think about it, the more it becomes clear to me that understanding the Fourth is the key to understanding Shostakovich, the problem being that it seems impossible to understand. I was recently reading Ian MacDonald's (revised) account of it and wondering how the author imagined that his flights of programmatic fancy could be taken seriously, except in so far as there are some interesting insights buried among them here and there.
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