antimuzak
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« on: 19:48:42, 31-05-2007 » |
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What a sad reflection on British cultural life that next weeks copy of Radio Times has no highlighted information about the Elgar anniversary on Radio and TV next week. Instead, we get wall to wall pop, as if classical music had ceased to exist.
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smittims
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« Reply #1 on: 08:51:43, 01-06-2007 » |
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Yes,today 'music' means pop to most people,and even a documentary about the Biritish museum has to have jangling electric guitars and drums.
I was struck by the irony of another BBC documentary in which the presenter was rejoicing in the peace of nature,with only the distant bird song. Of course this was a cue for some heavy metal to burst in on the sound track . The producer was probably unaware of the contradiction.
Stockhausen said that after the War he never wantedto hera another miklirtary march ever again.I somnetimes feel that after the twentieth century I never want to hear another drum.
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pim_derks
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« Reply #2 on: 09:11:34, 01-06-2007 » |
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It's a matter of balance: I like classical music but I also like a lot of light music and pop music as well. But I agree with the opinion that there's too much attention for pop music. A lot of this attention has nothing to do with music at all. This is also the case with classical music, by the way.
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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Stevo
Posts: 56
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« Reply #3 on: 12:27:23, 02-06-2007 » |
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I notice BBC online have included an article in the Hereford + Worcester section of England on their news: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/hereford/worcs/6714709.stmWhy do people insist on making Sir Edward so provincial? The greatest disservice that has been paid to him over the last 150 years is all this nonsense about him being the "quintessentially English" composer. |
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smittims
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« Reply #4 on: 10:57:37, 04-06-2007 » |
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Inded,Stevo.In comparison with Parry,Stanford,Vaughan Williams and Bax Elgar is much more 'European' as the audiences and critics in Germany realised a hundred years ago.
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Peter Grimes
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« Reply #5 on: 11:53:02, 04-06-2007 » |
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Ernest Newman visited Elgar in early February 1934, when the composer was already gravely ill and in terrible pain from the tumour on the sciatic nerve which killed him. Newman recalled the meeting years later with this peculiar comment:
"... after a brief silence, he made a single short remark about himself which I have never disclosed to anyone and have no intention of ever disclosing, for it would lend itself too easily to the crudest of misinterpretations ... It explains a good deal in him that has always been obscure or puzzling to us ..."
Newman also wrote to Gerald Abraham in the late Fifties, saying:
"Elgar's distressing remark consisted of only five words, but the scope they would give to a 'reading' of him is infinite, so I am determined to keep them to myself: they are too tragic for the ear of the mob."
Perhaps Newman just wanted to draw attention to himself, but I have always wondered what on earth Elgar could have said to him, speaking as he was from his deathbed. Possibly "I never liked you Ernest"? We'll never know.
I'm looking forward to seeing yards and yards from Ian Pace dealing with Elgar the bourgeois capitalist imperialist! Just kidding, Ian. We love you really.
The best book on the composer is Michael Kennedy's "Portrait of Elgar" (IMO).
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"On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog."
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smittims
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« Reply #6 on: 09:33:25, 05-06-2007 » |
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I've never been able to trust William Roberts since I discovered that 'Ernest Newman' was not his real name.
If he was so determined never to reveal the remark, it seems incredibly perverse and provocative to mention the incident at all. I came to the conclusion that he meant
'I know something about Elgar that you don't; Nyaaa!'.
Incidentally, I gather that at one time there were several women claiming to be Elgar's love-child. I'm not aware of any real evidence that he ever had an affair,though Michael Kennedy says one of his servants said he was a naughty old man and Lalla Vandervelde said he once chased her round the biliard table.It's about that level, I think.
Then of course there was Rosa.but that's another story. I always think it would make a lovely Merchant Ivory film,like 'The Remains of the Day'..
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Lord Byron
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« Reply #7 on: 08:42:28, 06-06-2007 » |
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What a sad reflection on British cultural life that next weeks copy of Radio Times has no highlighted information about the Elgar anniversary on Radio and TV next week. Instead, we get wall to wall pop, as if classical music had ceased to exist.
Do you mean the issue with darcy bussell on the front cover ? |
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John W
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« Reply #8 on: 21:02:35, 08-06-2007 » |
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Here's another 'sad reflection' on classical music in Britain on the BBC ........
I often listen to Radio 2's Friday Night Is Music Night, and having missed all the R3 Elgar celebrations I thought I should catch some of Radio 2's celebration. Quite amusing to hear Charles Hazlewood on there again. He significantly slows down the speed of his speech on Radio 2, a bit less verbal diarrhoea than usual though he did sneak in one of his favourite words enunciate when talking about the introduction of the Enigma theme.
Quite astonished that only the Intro - No 1 - No 4 - No 9 of the variations were played but even more astonished what Radio 2 did to Elgar's Cello Concerto. Look at the order of play in the live concert tonight:
Pomp and Circumstance March No. 4
Serenade For Strings 1st movement
Cello Concerto -1st Movement
Cello Concerto -2nd Movement
Chanson De Matin
Fantasia and Fugue In C Minor (Bach arr. Elgar)
15min intermission (about John Barrie)
Enigma Variations Intro-No 1 - No 4 - No 9
Cello Concerto - 3rd Movement
Cello Concerto - 4th Movement
The Crown Of India Suite - Interlude
Pomp and Circumstance March No. 1
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Stanley Stewart
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« Reply #9 on: 22:20:34, 08-06-2007 » |
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Puerile and pathetic programming, John.
I commend your stamina.
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pim_derks
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« Reply #10 on: 23:02:18, 08-06-2007 » |
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What a pity that there was so little attention for Elgar's light music on Friday Night Is Music Night. A thing I really like about Elgar is that he wrote both light music and "serious" music. The lighter Elgar would have been more suitable for this programme: they would have been able to play complete pieces in this way. And why not a few vocal pieces? A very strange concert, I must say.  By the way, here's another strange concert: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/performanceon3/pip/5lq4b/I'm most surprised about that "Contemplation No 1" (Ives): we never see that on concert programmes, so why add it now? Perhaps to make it even more clear that we are going to miss the other one? A complete performance of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony would have been more suitable for the re-opening of the Royal Festival Hall, I think.  |
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« Last Edit: 23:30:01, 08-06-2007 by pim_derks »
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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Stanley Stewart
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« Reply #11 on: 12:36:01, 09-06-2007 » |
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# 9 A further thought on Friday Night Is Music Night, John.
I recall being a regular listener when the programme used to follow Any Questions on the Light Programme, or Home Service? Can't recall the name of the announcer (sic) who used to conclude the broadcast, prior to the play-out fanfare, with a resonating "To prove, once again, that Friday Night IS Music Night." Was it Jimmy Kingsbury?
Valerie Masterson used to be a regular guest and the travesty of last night's programming was high unlikely.
Pim_derks comments much more in keeping with the character of this much loved programme. By the way, Pim, after our recent chat on "A Song to Remember", I thought of you when the "The Silver Fleet" (1943) was shown on MORE 4 the other day. This was a popular wartime flagwaver based on resistance, in Holland, on the life of Pete Hein.
Pete Hein, Pete Hein, his name will always shine;
with his little ships so neat,
he beat the mighty silver fleet:
Pete Hein, Pete Hein.
It appealed to us as schoolkids.
Bws, Stanley
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George Garnett
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« Reply #12 on: 13:06:32, 09-06-2007 » |
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but even more astonished what Radio 2 did to Elgar's Cello Concerto. What a very, very weird thing to do. I'm rather glad I missed it. Mind you, BBC2 gave us just three movements of Mahler's Song of the Earth that same evening  . Maybe it's something to do with Fridays. Just an aside. I do actually think it's very cheering that the Elgar Cello Concerto, surely a very great and subtle work indeed on anyone's terms, is resolutely up there among the nation's 'Classical Favourites'. It can't just be 'marketing'. It obviously speaks to large numbers of people on its own terms. |
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pim_derks
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« Reply #13 on: 14:08:45, 09-06-2007 » |
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Pim_derks comments much more in keeping with the character of this much loved programme. By the way, Pim, after our recent chat on "A Song to Remember", I thought of you when the "The Silver Fleet" (1943) was shown on MORE 4 the other day. This was a popular wartime flagwaver based on resistance, in Holland, on the life of Pete Hein.
Pete Hein, Pete Hein, his name will always shine;
with his little ships so neat,
he beat the mighty silver fleet:
Pete Hein, Pete Hein.
It appealed to us as schoolkids. Many thanks for this information, Stanley. I never saw The Silver Fleet. I would love to see it! The complete title in Dutch of the Piet Hein song is: Een triomfantelijk lied van de
Zilvervloot. Here are the famous lines in Dutch: Piet Hein, Piet Hein,
Zijn naam is klein,
Zijn daden bennen groot,
Hij heeft gewonnen de Zilvervloot.The music was written by Joannes Josephus Viotta, father of Henri Viotta, the founder of the Residentie Orchestra (The Hague). The Dutch composer and music critic Peter van Anrooy based an orchestral rhapsody on the song. Antal Dorati made an excellent recording of this piece with the Residentie Orchestra somewhere in the 1950s. There’s also a more recent recording conducted by Kees Bakels. Please let me know it if you are interested! Another remarkable film is Betrayed (1954), starring Clark Gable and Lana Turner. It’s a spy story set in the Netherlands during the German occupation. The funny thing is that we don’t see Gable in the Netherlands: we see him only inside buildings and houses (I think these scenes were shot in the United States), but we never see him in the open air!  Best wishes, Pim |
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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Stanley Stewart
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« Reply #14 on: 17:50:55, 09-06-2007 » |
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Thanks, pim. I see that I've sent a fuller reply to my earlier comments, but for some reason, have posted it on Radio 3 General Discussions! It may be of interest to you.
Too much of the sun, today, I fear
Bws Stanley
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