|
richard barrett
|
 |
« Reply #3105 on: 17:11:56, 19-07-2008 » |
|
I've been spinning a certain amount of J C Bach over the past few days (mostly instrumental music but also Endimione, a "serenata", really a smallish opera). One reason was to try and work out what it is I find attractive about his music, given that it consists to such an extent of the kind of textures, forms and materials which Mozart was to take up and use to more "modern" dramatic effect (playing Stockhausen to JC's Goeyvaerts, ahem  ). The more I get to know it, though, the more individual (and in a way the more Baroque) it seems to sound: while it's the earlier Mozart that it's most reminiscent of, it's also clearly the work of a maturer composer; also, his use of rather intricate instrumental obbligati in several arias (not to mention his numerous sinfonie concertante) and highly-variegated orchestration (fragmenting the orchestra in a sometimes almost Rameau-like way) are entirely his own, while the virtuosity of some of his vocal parts is some way in excess of what Mozart generally preferred. The G minor Symphony op.6/6 gives Haydn a run for his Sturm und Drang too. So that's been a fascinating investigation which I'd recommend others to undertake if they haven't already. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
John W
|
|
« Reply #3106 on: 17:20:48, 19-07-2008 » |
|
The G minor Symphony op.6/6 gives Haydn a run for his Sturm und Drang too. So that's been a fascinating investigation which I'd recommend others to undertake if they haven't already.
Richard, I have that symphony on the BrilliantCD 'Bach Sons' box set so I will revisit. Strina, Below are the three pages on notes on 'Il Trionfo...', talks about Corelli last para of page 9 and into page 10.    |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Bryn
|
|
« Reply #3107 on: 18:34:50, 19-07-2008 » |
|
Thanks for the heads-up on the Frank Zappa disc, Bryn. I still recall his great gig at Manchester, in 1969.
SS, please note it is Dweezil fronting a band of mainly long in the tooth musicians, most of whom are old Zappa stalwarts. Some good playing, but it's not FVZ. It's a double DVD set. It is cheaper if you can handle Zone 1 discs. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
strinasacchi
|
|
« Reply #3108 on: 18:57:57, 19-07-2008 » |
|
Thanks for that, John. Hmm, I'll have to double-check my sources - I could have sworn I've read somewhere that it was the high-lying stuff (more virtuosic, more "Italian") that Corelli objected to. As virtuosic as he undoubtedly was, Corelli never (?) wrote above a high E, a mere octave above the open string.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
John W
|
|
« Reply #3109 on: 19:08:39, 19-07-2008 » |
|
Strina, On page 10 it does mention adding extra challenge of high-lying notes, so that wouldn't have pleased Corelli either; yes some digging required  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
oliver sudden
|
|
« Reply #3110 on: 01:35:21, 20-07-2008 » |
|
Ma, caro Sassone, questa Musica è nel Stylo Francese, di ch'io non m'intendo is certainly the quote I know best as far as the Handel/Corelli thing goes. I can imagine that if Corelli wasn't used to overdotting à la française his renditions of French overture-style music might indeed have lacked something - it's certainly the crushed dotted rhythms (especially when there's a run after the dot instead of just a single note) that give that style much of its "fire and force" and that's a convention that isn't notated. (Indeed some (not I) contend that Bach's 'French' music shouldn't even be performed that way but that's another story...)
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
oliver sudden
|
|
« Reply #3111 on: 01:45:13, 20-07-2008 » |
|
I've spun this a few times over the last three days; it's incredibly good and makes the old credit card itchy for the imminent release of Nos.3 & 6!  I'm itchy not just for the new concertos disc (which I've had for a few weeks now and it's excellent) but for LOTS more recordings of this music in this kind of setup. For those who don't know: essentially it's a chamber orchestra, mostly with two strings per part (but only two violins in total!). There's also no conductor (in post-Spohr/Berlioz sense of a time-beater who doesn't play in the orchestra) and the temperament they use seems to me much less equal than even the period-instrument groups were trying for some years back. Since period-instrument performance practice in these pieces seems not to have moved on much for well over a decade (at least as far as recordings go) it's high time for such a thing, I reckon. Ensemble 28's recording of the Eroica is another fine thing although for me their interpretation is still a bit too centrally regulated. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Bryn
|
|
« Reply #3112 on: 08:30:14, 20-07-2008 » |
|
I've spun this a few times over the last three days; it's incredibly good and makes the old credit card itchy for the imminent release of Nos.3 & 6! ... the temperament they use seems to me much less equal than even the period-instrument groups were trying for some years back. Nah. You ask then guys over at TOP, it's just that these HIPP types can't play in tune for the life of 'em.  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #3114 on: 14:11:40, 20-07-2008 » |
|
I second RB's penchant for JC Bach -- but am myself unable to explain it. I have a set of Bassoon concertos that are unremarkable in every way except that they are very enchanting.
Right. Everything about it seems to point towards dullness, and yet it isn't dull in the least. Although I've moved on to CPE today while I'm waiting for the CDs of JC I ordered to arrive ... does anyone know CPE's viola da gamba sonatas? These are absolutely wonderful I think, showing his melodic, harmonic and expressive individuality in concentrated form. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
pim_derks
|
|
« Reply #3115 on: 15:56:12, 20-07-2008 » |
|
Franz von Suppé - Famous OverturesVienna State Opera Orchestra conducted by Walter Goehr Fantastic!
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
|
|
|
|
opilec
|
|
« Reply #3116 on: 01:01:31, 21-07-2008 » |
|
It's great to have this transferred to CD at last:  Verses for Ensembles comes up particularly well: it sounds amazingly vivid, and such a vital performance! |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: 01:11:34, 21-07-2008 by opilec »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
MT Wessel
|
|
« Reply #3117 on: 01:40:10, 21-07-2008 » |
|
Ikebukuro from The Shutov Assembly by you (should?) know who. It is darker than a dark thing on dark tablets.  |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: 01:48:45, 21-07-2008 by MT Wessel »
|
Logged
|
lignum crucis arbour scientiae
|
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #3118 on: 10:44:10, 21-07-2008 » |
|
Ikebukuro from The Shutov Assembly by you (should?) know who. It is darker than a dark thing on dark tablets. You interest me strangely, Mr Wessel, I don't know that disc at all, having somewhat lost interest in Brain One some time in the 1980s. Probably I should do some catching up some time. (I did have a go at Another Day on Earth but found it pretty routine.) Spinning here is an excellent 1970s recording of Bach's Brandenburg Concertos directed by the man known in "crackpot" circles simply as Gustav, assisted by the brothers Kuijken and other luminaries from the Low Countries. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Morticia
|
|
« Reply #3119 on: 11:09:53, 21-07-2008 » |
|
This, courtesy of a kind Forum Member back in the days of TOP. It's quite wonderful and exactly what is required today  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
