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roslynmuse
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« Reply #195 on: 00:40:02, 08-05-2007 » |
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roslynmuse, I'm not sure that early editions always need to be "treated with caution": often they can be more revealing (certainly of contemporary practice) than musicologically "cleaner" later editions. I'm not sure what the current status of the Mahler complete edition is, though some of the scores were issued by Eulenberg, replacing older editions by the likes of Redlich IIRC.
I recently managed to pick up scores of both the Sixth and Eighth symphonies in what look like first editions, as well as an early vocal score of Das Lied von der Erde. These early editions are probably the ones used by Dover, as the copyright has long since expired.
I agree that not all early editions need to be treated with caution - it largely depends on the editor/ publishing house. French music, however, (which interests me greatly) is notoriously error-strewn, and the Dover Debussy songs, for example, includes a very dodgy edition of the Ariettes oubliees. Maybe Mahler was generally luckier in his first printings! |
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tonybob
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« Reply #196 on: 09:19:30, 12-05-2007 » |
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Mahler 9 on CD review this morning.
should be easy...
Karajan will probably come up trumps, not my favourite.
opilec?
walter vpo recorded 1735?
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« Last Edit: 09:21:37, 12-05-2007 by tonybob »
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sososo s & i.
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smittims
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« Reply #197 on: 10:01:32, 12-05-2007 » |
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I wonder which is worse for poor Mahler, missing the royalties his music would earn were he alive today, or having to heat so many conductors working off their egos on one of his most personal music.
Klemperer and Maderna are my favourites.They give me Mahler the restless questing intellectual rather than the self-pitying Christ-substitute I hear in some indulgent interpretaions.
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eruanto
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« Reply #198 on: 10:21:24, 12-05-2007 » |
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Is anyone else, like me, having problems staying awake during the spoken commentary? I am! I don't usually listen to CD review but made a special exception for this case. I can't say I agree with this kind of indulgent analysis .. particularly not for Mahler However, as one for who it takes many listenings to be able to say that I "know" a piece, the programme is useful; especially as I have only heard the karajan version. |
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Stevo
Posts: 56
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« Reply #199 on: 10:35:55, 12-05-2007 » |
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The soporific delivery notwithstanding, I can find little wrong with the first choice of Abbado/BPO on DG. A great statement by (IMO) the greatest living Mahlerian.
Interestingly, it usurps the previous BAL choice of 1994 which was Abbado/VPO.
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autoharp
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« Reply #200 on: 10:36:18, 12-05-2007 » |
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One from the archive. Sometime in the 1960s, an advert seeking support for an Anti-Mahler Society was placed in Private Eye. A further enquiry resulted in what you see below. . .
ANTI-MAHLER SOCIETY
____________________
A Non-Profit Making Organisation dedicated to the overthrow of GUSTAV MAHLER, Arch Bore.
____
The Anti-Mahler society exists to co-ordinate the campaign to stamp out the Mahler cult. At present it consists of a tiny handful of only the most dedicated opponents of Mahler. But with help it will grow into an enormous organisation with world-wide support.
You can help immediately by
a) complaining to the BBC whenever you hear Mahler's frightful music played
b) letting the FESTIVAL HALL know that you abominate their pathetic adulation of the GREAT PSEUD OF VIENNA
c) writing to me at once with your views and criticisms of GLOOMY GUSTAV.
We would like to know anything to his discredit, including personal details etc.
All donations welcome.
L. GORRINGE
Secretary
Anti-Mahler Society
Box 169
Private Eye
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Tam Pollard
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« Reply #201 on: 10:39:11, 12-05-2007 » |
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I find the style of delivery far preferable to last week's effort (though still not great).
Smittims, we have, of course, no idea what Mahler would have thought of what conductors do to the piece. However, he certainly had no problem trampling on the works of others (I believe he used to put the Leonora 3 overture between the scenes of act 2 of Fidelio when performing it - a practice I rather approve of).
The reviewer seemed to me to place to high a premium on textual fidelity. In any Mahler (given the number of alterations made by the composer) this is a bit futile. Of course, you can get away with it with the ninth since a score that might be called 'definitive' exists. But that is to miss the point. The only reason the 9th isn't as riddled with with alterations as others is that he didn't really live to finish - that is to say perform it and decide to do some things differently.
regards, Tam
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Stevo
Posts: 56
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« Reply #202 on: 10:41:27, 12-05-2007 » |
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Anti- Mahler Society. That's... so... funny.
I had a scientist friend who did 'jokes' like that. Boy, was he hard work.
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tonybob
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« Reply #204 on: 10:57:02, 12-05-2007 » |
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i missed it! ha! the abbado is great. the maderna - is it the one on bbc legends? Anti- Mahler Society. That's... so... funny.
I had a scientist friend who did 'jokes' like that. Boy, was he hard work.
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sososo s & i.
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smittims
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« Reply #205 on: 11:45:25, 12-05-2007 » |
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Yes,the Maderna is BBC Legends, BBCL 4179-2. The Klemperer has just been reissued oin EMI's 'Great Recordings of the Century ' series,and isa2disc set coipled with the Siegfried Idyll and Strauss ' Metamorphosen',a classic performance by the man who once tried to organise a boycott ofStrauss' works after he accepted office under the Nazis.
I seem to be alone in finding Abbado dull, competent and correct but lifeless.I have a film of him conducting 'Lohengrin'and I've yet to watch it to the end. Mind you the staging is unimaginative (Vienna Opera).Tne sword fight is even worse than the one in Mel Gibson's 'Hamlet' ,but then ,I suppose anyone who knows the Olivier would say that .
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tonybob
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« Reply #206 on: 11:57:38, 12-05-2007 » |
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movement 2 onwards in the abbado are wonderful.
a lot have trouble with the calmness of the 1st movement, it misses out on everything the klemperer 1st movement has.
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sososo s & i.
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Stanley Stewart
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« Reply #207 on: 13:31:54, 12-05-2007 » |
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Earlier, I thought that the final choice would be in favour of Bernstein and CGB, Amsterdam. George Solti didn't even rate a mention, although his performance with the Chicago S. O. at the Royal Festival Hall, in September 1981 will always be rather special for me.
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Stevo
Posts: 56
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« Reply #208 on: 09:29:25, 13-05-2007 » |
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I seem to be alone in finding Abbado dull, competent and correct but lifeless.
Funnily enough, that's what I feel about the majority of Rattle's Mahler. I'd urge you to give the Berlin Mahler 9 a listen; I cannot think of a less appropriate word than 'dull' to describe this performance. |
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Tam Pollard
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« Reply #209 on: 11:24:24, 13-05-2007 » |
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I seem to be alone in finding Abbado dull, competent and correct but lifeless.
Funnily enough, that's what I feel about the majority of Rattle's Mahler. I find some of Rattle's Mahler falls into this category (and the Vienna 9th is one of them). It's odd, a few months ago I worked through his whole cycle and it's amazing how un-live some of the 'live' recordings like the 1st and the 9th seem. Then again, the genuinely live Berlin 6th is extremely exciting (and streets ahead of the studio recording made just a little while afterwards). He came to Edinburgh with the Berliners last summer and played the 4th in what was a wonderfully fresh reading. I have been hoping someone had the good sense to tape one of the performances for CD release (as it was a much better reading than the one he put out with the CBSO). regards, Tam |
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