Mmm. Nicely positioned sphinctilium. 

Oh for goodness sake, George. Every time a thurible gets mentioned ...  . Resist, just for once. 

Where do you stand, Don B, on the whirling through 360 degrees question? Naff or acceptable? I first saw it done in the Robert Altman film A Wedding and embarrassed myself by laughing out loud in the cinema. I thought it was a joke. But it's spread to St Albans now, on big no-holds-barred occasions up by the shrine anyway. Terrifying if you aren't expecting it and standing too close. Mutterings of 'We are meant to be Protestants you know' from the ranks as well. 

 

There's no whirling through 360 degrees at our place.  However, our regular thurifer, when in his mid-teens, used to see if he could get away with whacking his sister with the thurible (if she was sitting close enough) when the altar party were in the central aisle during the Gospel reading.  He's grown out of that now!  We in the choir get a prime view of any such misbehaviour as we sing from a gallery by the organ loft.

If that was the old "Excuse me, miss, you're handbag's on fire" chestnut, thank you, anty.

The First Welsh Gay Bishop!!  Currently Dean of Snorbans!

 Dr Jeffrey John has long campaigned for the church to relax its opposition to homosexuality The Very Rev Jeffrey John was appointed Bishop of Reading five years ago but was forced to stand down by the Archbishop of Canterbury, a personal friend of his, after the election sparked outrage among conservatives.

He was later made the Dean of St Albans but is now being considered for the post of Bishop of Bangor in North Wales, following the death of the previous incumbent from cancer in June.

Insiders believe 55-year-old Dr John is highly likely to be chosen, because he is a Welsh speaker as well as being a respected theologian.

In addition, the Archbishop of Wales, Dr Barry Morgan, recently admitted he would support the election of a gay bishop despite opposition among orthodox Anglicans and guidelines stating that practising homosexuals should not become clergy.

His appointment would likely deepen the crisis in the 80 million-strong worldwide church over homosexuality.

Dr John has long campaigned for the church to relax its opposition to homosexuality, and is in a civil partnership with his long-term partner, the Rev Grant Holmes, although he insists their relationship is celibate.

Shortly after the row over his appointment in 2003, the Communion was "fractured" by the election of the Rt Rev Gene Robinson, who is openly gay and in an active sexual relationship, as the Bishop of New Hampshire.

Hundreds of American clergy and parishioners deserted the liberal Episcopal Church in protest, triggering bitter legal disputes over church property, while orthodox Anglican leaders across the world are forging ahead with a rival movement for those who believe the Bible teaches that homosexuality is sinful.

At last month's once-a-decade summit of Anglican bishops, the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, urged liberals not to inflame tensions by electing any more gay bishops.

But the Rt Rev David Anderson, President of the American Anglican Council which represents conservative clergy, claims the "moratorium" is now likely to be broken in Wales.

He wrote in a letter to AAC members this week: "Wales is in an election process for Bishop of Bangor and the election has as one of its still-secret nominees none other than Jeffrey John, sometime bishop designee for Reading, who had to withdraw when the appointment created an uproar.

"Failing to take the prize home with him, he was given an appointment as a Cathedral Dean to console him, but it now appears that some stock options for the future were thrown in as well.

"Although being on the slate is no guarantee of an election, it is clearly something that Archbishop Morgan desires, having said that practising homosexuals should not be barred from becoming bishops, and having called the opponents of such consecrations 'exclusive and narrow-minded'."

An official in the Church in Wales said: "He's Welsh, he's a Welsh speaker and he's a high-ranking clergyman so his name may well be put forward."

The Rev Giles Fraser, the vicar of Putney, added: "Being celibate, he meets all the criteria that have been set out in the church's position on homosexuality. He would make an excellent bishop, and it's about time."

The clergy of Bangor and bishops of Wales will meet next Wednesday to discuss the vacant role while the election of the next bishop will take place on October 10. The successful candidate must win two-thirds of the votes.

Dr John is currently on holiday and was unavailable for comment.

He's almost my favourite clergyman, even if he was straight.  And he is not a theological liberal.

I hate to say it, but if they do appoint him, that's going to be a major headache for the Anglican Communion. If it comes to the point of a split, I don't really have any doubts that the Church of England will move to exclude both the Church in Wales and the American Episcopal Church from the Communion in the interests of keeping the Africans on board, and keeping some kind of middle-way. Partly it will come down to economics. The church in North America is probably self-sufficient in terms of funding, as (I would imagine) is the Church in Wales. The African Church has already cut many ties with the Anglican Communion but is one of the poorest Churches in the Communion.

This whole thing makes me very very sad. I have more to say on the subject but I just can't bring myself to think about it much more.
I just don't think I'm an Anglican anymore.

Not a good day for the Anglican Church in Wales:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/mid/7596168.stm

A a time when the Anglican church is in enough turmoil as it is, a gay Bishop in Wales is surely a move that would exacerbate matters severely, almost certainly occasioning a split in the Communion. And if I can see the unfortunate link in his possible title, then I'm sure that sections of the media will have a field day with it, should he get the post: it would help to make the whole affair more newsworthy, yes, but not for the right reasons. A very difficult decision.

This idea that all Africans are hostile to gays is inaccurate.  We had a lovely straight priest from Ghana doing his PhD in London attached to our parish, and he never had any problem.  He greeted my partner when he rolled up at my church with a big hug, and he was outside a central London Church handing out pink lemonade IIRC after Gay Pride one year.  He had the patience of a saint to put up with our vicar, but that was certainly not because he couldn't get on with out gays.

Desmond Tutu was always supportive of gays, and he is African if anyone remembers.

There are some nasty homophobic Americans and Brits who like to do a bit of stirring, and I am sure there are African bishops who resent being patronised.

I honestly don't think that Jeffrey John being a bishop would cause anything like the splits imagined.  It might, but compared to the English Civil War and the Dissolution of the Monasteries, it would be a flea bite.  The Church in Wales became independent of the Church of England in 1920.

Frankly I wouldn't wish being a bishop on anyone.