I feel a bit awkward about something.  I'm a bit ashamed, but I'm not upset about it enough to merit posting on the 'Meetings Life's Challenges and Upsets' thread.

That thread, I believe, was the replacement for the 'Depression Thread'.  Posts are often (rightly) met by many replies of personal support and encouragement - which this matter certainly does not deserve.  I think I am more curious to see whether other people experience what I experience and to learn, rather than to ask for advice on how to experience something else.

This thread could be used for people who want to post a minor feeling of unease.




Anyway, to the matter in hand:

I have made some criticisms of the Proms performance of Quartet for the End of Time.

On the one hand, I feel that such criticsm should be made.  I think the performers 'failed' Messaien in some respects (execution and interpretation), and I don't believe those things should be left unsaid - otherwise will be just begin to view such errors as acceptable.  My feelings towards the music, and my own internal views (my mental sound worlds) of what it should and shouldn't be, drive me to make these comments.

On the other hand, I feel awful about making such comments.  There are a few reasons for this:

On the whole the performance was really enjoyable, so why should I highlight the few bits that didn't work?  (The other part of me says that its the only way next performances will be better still.)

Who on earth am I to make such comments?  I'm not a learned Messaien scholar, and my judgement about how it should sound is partly from a not-very-deep understanding of the work but mainly from a more general view about western music.

And I have this nagging voice that says "You couldn't do any better!".  I freely admit that.  (In fact my playing is very poor at the moment, a viscious circle seeing as it gives me little joy when I practise.)  But another part of me says, "It doesn't matter about my ability to play - it matters about my ability to listen."



Do other people feel awkward criticising performances / compositions?  I sometimes admire those people who manage to focus on the good bits and speak only of those, but at other times I just feel bad things have to be pointed out.

Tommo

Tommo, speaking as a composer I am more than interested in the opinions of my music of those people I like and respect, whether they're musicians or not. I don't give a fig about whether they couch their comments in 'musical' terms. I value criticism. It's useful. This board has loads of people who are actually very good indeed at describing their reactions to music, negatively or positively. Daniel is a case in point.

Relax, and tell it like you hear it. 

Thanks everyone - that's given me a good perspective.  I feel less awkward now.

Tommo

It's interesting and heartening to read what others have had to say on this topic.

I've found, on several occasions that I've listened to a piece of music, which was either very original or not really of a genre I have much knowledge of, myself compelled to respond with some form of constructive criticism, even though I haven't fully felt up to the task myself.  In some such cases, not all the qualifications I try to include (talk of my extreme consciousness of the subjectiveness of my thoughts, of the small weight I myself give them, but that I feel the work important enough to try to say something about) have stopped the remarks from, it seems, causing some hurt to the artists involved in producing the work.  It's annoying, because such comments were always predicated upon a great appreciation and high valuation of the works.  I do think I've gotten a little better at it, but I still find it rather difficult and awkward.

Indeed.  Also:  positive comments can be as vapid and insipid as negative ones.

It all depends on who says things Tommo.I am not allowed an opinion.

A

Like Martle, I welcome feedback whether it relates to my compositions or performances. The problem after concerts is that most people are so damned polite. As far as the compositions are concerned, I know what I think of them, although my opinions may change over time: it's not going to be hurtful if people tell me that they don't get on with something, or have reservations, or think I'm barking up the wrong tree, or even tell me it's a pile of ****. I may agree or disagree, but I'll probably be interested in the point of view if it comes from somebody I respect; and that person doesn't have to be a musician. It does help if my own suspicions are confirmed.
This afternoon I was listening for the first time in years to a performance I did in 1992. Some of the pieces were played at speeds which I now view as ludicrous. Surely somebody else realised that at the time? And might have told me!

Ludicrously fast or ludicrously slow?

As for criticism after concerts, I generally shy away from voicing reservations to composers/performers at that point because it doesn't seem like an appropriate time to do so. (On the other hand, sometimes it's the only opportunity you get.) It also depends on my relationship to the people involved - if someone is a close friend that generally prevents me from being very critical, even if I feel like being so, while there's anyone else listening (or reading, as in a forum like this), because for me it's part of friendship to be supportive in public even if one is critical in private.

Not if past experience is anything to go by Mort