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Author Topic: Poetry Appreciation Thread.  (Read 19823 times)
richard barrett
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« Reply #735 on: 10:46:10, 21-08-2008 »

Pete Townshend's day job of course is as a commissioning editor for Faber and Faber, publishers of Hughes' poetry...

(oh, I see Ron got there first, sorry)
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harmonyharmony
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« Reply #736 on: 10:48:10, 21-08-2008 »

Music by Pete Townshend of The Who, no less, hh (no doubt due to the Faber connection): less ground-breaking than Tommy or Quadrophenia, but not devoid of great numbers: the two on the original album, sung by John Lee Hooker and Nina Simone respectively, are real creackers...

My drama teacher knew him (Townshend) and got him to come and talk to us before the show. I was there with my youth music-drama troupe (called 'pretentious' by the Scotsman in our first and only appearance at the Edinburgh Fringe, 1995).
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'is this all we can do?'
anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965)
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time_is_now
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« Reply #737 on: 11:54:12, 21-08-2008 »

I think none of his other work comes near the concentration of Crow, where he climbs above the "typical Ted Hughes" quality of most of the rest of his work to create a kind of myth-cycle which at the same time is completely new and gives the impression of being more ancient than language. There's a recording of Hughes reading it which makes my hair stand on end.
I always thought Ted Hughes was a pretty bad poet; maybe I should have another look at Crow, although the bits posted above don't exactly convince me I was wrong.

Re copyright: Mr MacRae must know something about that, if he's around, having had a half-hour Ted Hughes setting premiered at the Proms just over a week ago.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
harmonyharmony
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« Reply #738 on: 12:01:36, 21-08-2008 »

I always thought Ted Hughes was a pretty bad poet; maybe I should have another look at Crow, although the bits posted above don't exactly convince me I was wrong.

I think that some of the power of Crow comes from accretion not from individual poems.
Or I could have picked some of the weaker poems.
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'is this all we can do?'
anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965)
http://www.myspace.com/itensemble
richard barrett
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« Reply #739 on: 12:06:33, 21-08-2008 »

I always thought Ted Hughes was a pretty bad poet; maybe I should have another look at Crow, although the bits posted above don't exactly convince me I was wrong.

I think that some of the power of Crow comes from accretion not from individual poems.
Or I could have picked some of the weaker poems.

I don't think you did, and I do think the collection needs to be taken as a whole, and I suspect that t_i_n might still not be impressed.
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George Garnett
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« Reply #740 on: 12:50:52, 21-08-2008 »

As Poet Laureate a fine writer of public ceremonial too:


Lines on The Queen's Silver Jubilee

The sky split apart in malice
Stars rattled like pans on a shelf
Crow shat on Buckingham Palace
God pissed Himself.
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Sydney Grew
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« Reply #741 on: 13:15:37, 21-08-2008 »

We find quite repulsive the text by T. Hughes (that "Ted" is the signifier of a monstrous over-grown infant is not it?) We do not understand how any one can imagine it possible that aesthetic value resides in the gruesome.


To clear the air then, here is something much nicer, and far more artistic in a small way: Out of Weakness by A.C. Benson, who of course when it came to prose was one of England's greatest twentieth-century writers.


                       OUT OF WEAKNESS
           
            TO-DAY, as far as eye can see,
              Or thought can multiply the sight,
            In tangled croft, on upland lea,
              A message flashed along the light
            Has worked strange marvels underground,
              And stirred a million sleeping cells,
            The rose has hope of being crowned;
              The foxglove dreams of purple bells;
           
            No tiny life that blindly strives,
              But thinks the impulse all his own,
            Nor dreams that countless other lives
              Like him, are groping, each alone;
            What dizzy sweetness, when the rain
              Has wept her fill of laden showers,
            To peep across the teeming plain,
              Through miles of upward-springing flowers!
           
            The brown seed bursts his armoured cap,
              And slips a white-veined arm between,
            White juicy stalks, a touch would snap,
              And twisted horns of sleekest green
            Now shift and turn from side to side,
              And fevered drink the stealing rain,
            As children fret at sermon-tide,
              When roses kiss the leaded pane.
           
            The tender, the resistless grace,
              That stirs the hopes of sleeping flowers,
            Could shake yon fortress to her base,
              And splinter those imperial towers;
            Concentred, bound, obedient,
              The soul that lifts those dreaming lids
            Could mock old Ramses' monument,
              And pile a thousand pyramids.

-oOo-
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richard barrett
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« Reply #742 on: 13:18:26, 21-08-2008 »

Lines on The Queen's Silver Jubilee

The sky split apart in malice
Stars rattled like pans on a shelf
Crow shat on Buckingham Palace
God pissed Himself.

 Grin  That's by jolly old Phil Larkin isn't it?
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George Garnett
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« Reply #743 on: 13:40:40, 21-08-2008 »

Swiftly rumbled there Cool. It was indeed by Hull's answer to the Chuckle Brothers.
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Ron Dough
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« Reply #744 on: 13:41:56, 21-08-2008 »


....Out of Weakness by A.C. Benson, who of course when it came to prose was one of England's greatest twentieth-century writers.

On that showing, Mr Grew, it would appear that his quality as a writer of prose may have deserted him when he turned to verse. Rather undistinguished antique pastiche, is it not? Aesthetic value is even less likely to reside in the twee.
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richard barrett
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« Reply #745 on: 13:56:42, 21-08-2008 »

Aesthetic value is even less likely to reside in the twee.

Nicely put, but I fear you and member Grew will be of two minds on that point.

Swiftly rumbled there Cool. It was indeed by Hull's answer to the Chuckle Brothers.

Don't get me wrong, I think it's brilliant and it's clear that Pip put his traditional craftsmanship to work on the metre and rhyme, though that's what gives the game away really.

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pim_derks
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« Reply #746 on: 15:45:21, 22-08-2008 »

A.C. Benson, who of course when it came to prose was one of England's greatest twentieth-century writers.

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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
Antheil
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« Reply #747 on: 16:45:52, 25-08-2008 »

I wonder how many know of Dafyyd ap Gwilym who wrote in the 1300s?  I think he is wonderful.

 The Girls of Llanbadarn

I am bent with wrath, 
a plague upon all the women of this parish! 
for I've never had (cruel, oppressive longing) 
a single one of them,
neither a virgin (a pleasant desire) 
nor a little girl nor hag nor wife. 
What hindrance, what wickedness, 
what failing prevents them from wanting me? 
What harm could it do to a fine–browed maiden 
to have me in a dark, dense wood? 
It would not be shameful for her 
to see me in a bed of leaves. 

There was never a time when I did not love — 
never was any charm so persistent — 
even more than men of Garwy's ilk, 
one or two in a single day, 
and yet I've come no closer to winning one of these 
than if she'd been my foe. 

There was never a Sunday in Llanbadarn church 
(and others will condemn it) 
that my face was not turned towards the splendid girl 
and my nape towards the resplendent, Holy Lord. 
And after I'd been staring long 
over my feathers across my fellow parishioners, 
the sweet radiant girl would hiss 
to her campanion, so wise, so fair: 

'He has an adulterous look — 
his eyes are adept at disguising his wickedness — 
that pallid lad with the face of a coquette 
and his sister's hair upon his head.' 

'Is that what he has in mind?' 
says the other girl by her side, 
'While the world endures he'll get no response, 
to hell with him, the imbecile!' 

I was stunned by the bright girl's curse, 
meagre payment for my stupefied love. 
I might have to renounce 
this way of life, terrifying dreams. 
Indeed, I'd better become 
a hermit, a calling fit for scoundrels. 
Through constant staring (a sure lesson) 
over my shoulder (a pitiful sight), 
it has befallen me, who loves the power of verse, 
to become wry–necked without a mate.

(Translation by Swansea University)

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Reality, sa molesworth 2, is so sordid it makes me shudder
trained-pianist
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« Reply #748 on: 17:23:05, 25-08-2008 »

Thank you Antheil for this poem.
I love Ll sound in general and it is there at the very beginning.
This translation must be good. It is so difficult to make a good translation.

« Last Edit: 17:38:24, 25-08-2008 by trained-pianist » Logged
George Garnett
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« Reply #749 on: 17:34:50, 25-08-2008 »

My goodness, Dafydd ap Gwilym (fl. 1300), you too, eh?

Wonderful. Talk about the shock of recognition across the centuries. Thanks for that, Antheil.     
« Last Edit: 18:23:54, 25-08-2008 by George Garnett » Logged
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