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trained-pianist
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« Reply #120 on: 17:03:53, 23-08-2008 » |
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Reiner,
Examples that you give are not real. I think they make them up for Grammar training or something.
I never heard any one speak like that. Have you?
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #121 on: 17:50:46, 23-08-2008 » |
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Examples that you give are not real. You're right, of course - but this is the kind of stuff non-native-speakers suffer when learning  If you think that's bad, you should see some of the textbooks I learned from! "Sergey showed the aircraft to Tom. It was an Antonov-24. "What a beautiful aircraft!" said Tom. "We have no aircraft so advanced as this in America!". (I promise I am not making this up!). And now I am going to go to the theatre! That is I am going (a) on one occasion only, not habitually (b) on foot, not using any mode of transport (c) with the intention of not only going and also arriving at the destination, rather than in that general direction Ah, so very simple, eh?
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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richard barrett
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« Reply #122 on: 17:55:41, 23-08-2008 » |
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"What a beautiful aircraft!" said Tom. "We have no aircraft so advanced as this in America!". (I promise I am not making this up!).
As they say, you couldn't make it up. |
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trained-pianist
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« Reply #123 on: 18:05:17, 23-08-2008 » |
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I would die if I had to learn English like that. They use new system now with less grammar.
They tought us in the USA very well, with pictures, easy and useful dialogues. For example, a plumber will come and fix something. How you call a plumber, how he comes. There was humour in it. Everybody enjoyed it. Then we had to memorize it, but it was fun.
They gave minimum grammar for a while.
My Greek friend thought my Russian friend the old way. She had to memorize whole bunch of words like: turn- turn- turn, bring- brought- brought, etc. I could never do things like that.
I can learn much faster if I don't know that I am learning. I look at the pictures. They are funny that makes one relaxed. I think most people are like that unless they are academics.
I think this is the only way to learn.
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« Last Edit: 18:27:21, 23-08-2008 by trained-pianist »
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increpatio
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« Reply #124 on: 00:53:55, 24-08-2008 » |
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Was speaking to russian colleague today; he said that one of the hardest things, even for Russian speakers, is putting numbers themselves into different cases. he gave me some examples, but...I wasn't feeling particularly speedy and didn't really understand what he was saying  |
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #125 on: 11:16:14, 24-08-2008 » |
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Agreed on that one, Inky! I'm usually looking for an alternative locution when numeral-declining issues arise. But sometimes it's unavoidable... "Suite for flute & continuo in four movements" - would need a locative case, 'v chetir ex chastyax'. Perhaps it's a sin to derive vicarious pleasure on hearing native speakers get this stuff wrong? A very bad habit I've picked up in Siberia is the non-existent declining 'their'. 'Ix' doesn't decline and remains unchanged in correct usage - but in villages you'll hear they've 'created' a declining version because it 'sounds more correct' - 'ixnego cheloveka' etc. (t-p will be laughing at this Worzel Gummidge-style usage..) And another of my bad habits is saying 'moi chemodan' instead of the more correct 'svoi chemodan' ('my own suitcase'. Ho-hum... |
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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trained-pianist
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« Reply #126 on: 14:30:19, 24-08-2008 » |
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I don't know how you can pick up such samples, Reiner.
I will have to start calling and asking native people here how they would say it and take a poll.
In case of moi chemodan I have no doubts. What is mine is mine. This is my chemodan. But I carry svoi chemodan.
There is a Svoi chelovek (our person). That is another matter.
Svoe mnenie (my own opinion) uses that. But to say about suitcase that it is svoi would sound funny. I think Russians may laugh the way English people would laugh when someone is making mistake.
I don't think I know why. Just learn it like a parrot.
I don't think I analized too much while I was learning English. I was just repeating what people on TV were saying. I have an opinion that it is bad for me to think too much or too hard. ;
PS. U menya moi chemodan
U tebya tvoi chemodan
У нее ее чемодан
increpatio
What numerals are you learning. I don't understand. Can you give me an example.
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« Last Edit: 15:42:45, 24-08-2008 by trained-pianist »
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Antheil
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« Reply #127 on: 15:39:23, 24-08-2008 » |
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t-p, seeing as only 2% of posters here speak Russian, are you not flogging a dead mare?
Or Saired Cymraeg could elicit more response?
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« Last Edit: 16:04:11, 24-08-2008 by Antheil »
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Reality, sa molesworth 2, is so sordid it makes me shudder
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #128 on: 18:00:05, 24-08-2008 » |
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For all who want to, or need to, learn another language.. ...do you think you ever 'get there'? Do you ever stop learning? A sad & telling comment on my own uphill path with it... taxi-drivers like to guess where you're from. A month or two ago one concluded I must be frrom Bulgaria. I actually went home delighted to have been mistaken for a Bulgarian...  |
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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perfect wagnerite
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« Reply #129 on: 18:08:13, 24-08-2008 » |
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For all who want to, or need to, learn another language.. ...do you think you ever 'get there'? Do you ever stop learning? A sad & telling comment on my own uphill path with it... taxi-drivers like to guess where you're from. A month or two ago one concluded I must be frrom Bulgaria. I actually went home delighted to have been mistaken for a Bulgarian... A couple of years ago I was asked by a French shop assistant: "Etes-vous belges?" I don't think it was meant as a compliment. |
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At every one of these [classical] concerts in England you will find rows of weary people who are there, not because they really like classical music, but because they think they ought to like it. (Shaw, Don Juan in Hell)
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increpatio
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« Reply #130 on: 19:34:12, 24-08-2008 » |
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For all who want to, or need to, learn another language..
...do you think you ever 'get there'? Do you ever stop learning?
I don't know; I've never been particularly happy with my grasp of english even, to be honest...so...no? And: funny story |
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trained-pianist
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« Reply #131 on: 19:43:32, 24-08-2008 » |
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A sad & telling comment on my own uphill path with it... taxi-drivers like to guess where you're from. A month or two ago one concluded I must be frrom Bulgaria. I actually went home delighted to have been mistaken for a Bulgarian... Surprisingly enough I have very same problem and strangely enough they also think I am Bulgarian. increpatio, I just found out that my Russian is not as good as my English and Antheil doesn't understand me in Bulgarian. Our friend usually asks people he travels with: Are there any Hungarians here? And if the answer is No, he says that he is Hungarian. This friend lives in Germany. I decided that I don't care anymore. I hope this decision will last until tomorrow. |
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« Last Edit: 08:33:42, 25-08-2008 by trained-pianist »
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increpatio
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« Reply #132 on: 20:25:58, 24-08-2008 » |
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And if the answer is No, he says that he is Hungarian. heh. As an aside: I've heard the few people I've spoken to who've attempted hungarian saying it's rather a nasty language to have to learn. |
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Reiner Torheit
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« Reply #133 on: 21:09:08, 24-08-2008 » |
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I worked with an anglo-hungarian guy for several years - he was laconically unperturbed by mispellings and mispronounciations off Hungarian, along with the popular misconception that it's related to slavic languages or Romanian...
..the complex structure arises from its origins in Central Asia, I believe? One myth dispelled though - the alleged similarity to Finnish is clearly a remote one - "Went to Helsinki for a week, couldn't understand a bloody word of it!" opined my Hungarian chum...
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"I was, for several months, mutely in love with a coloratura soprano, who seemed to me to have wafted straight from Paradise to the stage of the Odessa Opera-House"
- Leon Trotsky, "My Life"
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richard barrett
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« Reply #134 on: 21:54:10, 24-08-2008 » |
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..the complex structure arises from its origins in Central Asia, I believe? One myth dispelled though - the alleged similarity to Finnish is clearly a remote one - "Went to Helsinki for a week, couldn't understand a bloody word of it!" opined my Hungarian chum...
An amateur linguist writes: they're both "Finno-Ugric" languages, so they're related to a similar kind of degree as English, French and Sanskrit (all being "Indo-European" languages). |
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