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pim_derks
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« Reply #30 on: 11:47:40, 13-04-2007 » |
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Not with composers, maybe, but in improvised music it's a very widespread way of doing things, with very different results in the hands of people like Chris Burn, Agusti Fernandez, Cor Fuhler, Wolfgang Mitterer, Marco Trevisani and many others...
... and Andrea Neumann who has (John might like this) had an instrument built to her own specifications: a portable piano frame, with strings but without action or keyboard
Thank you very much, richard. These names are all new to me. It's always interesting to discover something new. |
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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time_is_now
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« Reply #31 on: 11:51:53, 13-04-2007 » |
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Richard wrote a very good piece for the Chris Burn Ensemble, pim, though I've only heard it in its revised (and more strictly notated?) form as played by ELISION at Huddersfield last autumn. It's called Codex I.
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The city is a process which always veers away from the form envisaged and desired, ... whose revenge upon its architects and planners undoes every dream of mastery. It is [also] one of the sites where Dasein is assigned the impossible task of putting right what can never be put right. - Rob Lapsley
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pim_derks
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« Reply #32 on: 12:06:52, 13-04-2007 » |
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Richard wrote a very good piece for the Chris Burn Ensemble, pim, though I've only heard it in its revised (and more strictly notated?) form as played by ELISION at Huddersfield last autumn. It's called Codex I.
I'm reading about it on the internet, time_is_now. Thank you! |
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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richard barrett
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« Reply #33 on: 12:13:17, 13-04-2007 » |
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Why thank you, kind sir. The score used by Elision was in fact exactly the same one as used by the CBE. Each "event" in the score is assigned to a number of instruments without saying which ones they are, so a little bit of "orchestration" needs to be done before rehearsals begin. I did this for Elision, Chris Burn did it for his group, and the piece has also been done by a couple of groups in the USA which I had no influence over at all.
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ahinton
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« Reply #34 on: 12:42:36, 13-04-2007 » |
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With all due apologies (especially to Richard), I suppose I have to admit to being one of those antediluvian characters who prefers the prepared pianist...
Best,
Alistair
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George Garnett
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« Reply #35 on: 13:04:58, 13-04-2007 » |
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It doesn't mess up the piano though - after all the bits and pieces are taken back out it's just as it was before. Ah, thank you. Further proof that if you just wait long enough someone will come along eventually with the answer to all those questions that you were too embarrassed to ask. That ticks another one off the list. Unfortunately a supplementary usually appears to take its place. Presumably that means that you can't move a prepared piano about much (even on and off stage?) without messing it all up and you have to prepare them all over again? |
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richard barrett
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« Reply #36 on: 13:30:32, 13-04-2007 » |
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I think they'd mostly remain in place if you wheeled the piano around. Maybe they'd even hold the piano together if you dropped it off the back of a lorry, who knows.
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« Last Edit: 14:08:12, 13-04-2007 by richard barrett »
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aaron cassidy
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« Reply #37 on: 13:55:15, 13-04-2007 » |
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The second best live concert experience of my life That's a very Shakespearian turn of phrase if I may say so. Are we allowed to know where your best bed went?  Nono: Fragmente-Stille, An Diotima Bozzini Quartet June in Buffalo 2002 |
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aaron cassidy
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« Reply #38 on: 14:04:03, 13-04-2007 » |
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I think Pim has promised to make some clips of other Sonatas available on sendspace or somewhere, that would for sure make me listen because I like Pim  Well, here's an example of two different performances of Cage's Fifth Sonata. I would suggest, for JW & the other skeptics, that listening to the entire work is more useful than listening to a single movement. An excerpt does still allow one to be a bit dismissive of the approach as perhaps a bit gimmicky, but I would have a hard time imagining anyone still holding that opinion having heard the complete work from beginning to end in one sitting. |
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pim_derks
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« Reply #39 on: 14:42:00, 13-04-2007 » |
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The first piece for prepared piano that I heard was also the first piece of Cage that I ever heard: Daughters of the Lonesome Isle. It really made me like the sound of the prepared piano.
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"People hate anything well made. It gives them a guilty conscience." John Betjeman
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ahinton
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« Reply #40 on: 15:02:11, 13-04-2007 » |
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I think they'd mostly remain in place if you wheeled the piano around. Maybe they'd even hold the piano together if you dropped it off the back of a lorry, who knows.
Brilliant! That said, however, I think that the consistent employment of prepared piano removers would likely prevent such things from happening other than as a result of "acts of God" or such like... Best, Alistair |
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #41 on: 17:17:53, 13-04-2007 » |
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and Andrea Neumann who has (John might like this) had an instrument built to her own specifications: a portable piano frame, with strings but without action or keyboard At the other end of the spectrum, I've also seen (and conducted) a piano without strings but with action and hammers linked up to various junk and less junk objects; a piece by Bernd Thewes taking Marcel Duchamp as its starting point (called Sieben Sieben des Salzhändlers if I remember correctly) uses one in its final movement. |
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martle
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« Reply #42 on: 22:50:40, 13-04-2007 » |
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Now, here's a prepared piano:  Actually, when I was a student I had a huge argument about the dangers or otherwise about preparing a piano with the piano 'technician' emplyed by the institution. I had to go so far as to write to Steinways and get an afadavit to the effect that shoving all those bits of metal and rubber between the strings HAS NO DETRIMENTAL EFFECT AT ALL on the piano. It's a bit like a world-class athlete being bitten by an ant. Unless he/she's alergic to ant-bites of course. Er... |
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Green. Always green.
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oliver sudden
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« Reply #43 on: 23:04:04, 13-04-2007 » |
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To be fair, isn't getting sweat on the strings supposed to be a bad idea? In which case all the scrabbling around inside to get the things in would have to be done with a certain amount of care.
I was once playing a piece with piano which required the pianist to play harmonics by touching the string lightly at a carefully-chosen point before playing the note. The pianist maintained that marking these points with Tipp-Ex would cause no problem whatsoever. Which indeed it didn't, right up but alas not including the point where he tried to get the Tipp-Ex off again.
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martle
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« Reply #44 on: 23:07:13, 13-04-2007 » |
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No, Ollie. Or at least not according to my Steinway bloke. These mothers are built to withstand acts of god; so a bit of sweat or tippex is no sweat - if you get my drift.  |
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Green. Always green.
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