|
Ron Dough
|
 |
« Reply #105 on: 18:00:01, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Cripes, r!
<runs to wrap head in cold wet towel emoticon>
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
martle
|
|
« Reply #106 on: 18:01:47, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Yes, Sibelius could handle that page relatively simply and quickly. (Well, I mean, I could input it...)
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Green. Always green.
|
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #107 on: 18:02:27, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Thank you gentlemen. a basic score so that your publisher can tart it up later A basic score? moi? One thing which doesn't appear on that sample page is woodwind or brass fingering diagrams (for microtones, multiphonics and other "radically idiomatic" stuff), which will definitely be needed. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #108 on: 18:34:31, 12-08-2008 » |
|
I'd recommend a font-editor in that case. I use TypeTool from FontLab. It's really quite easy to use. Haven't created any fingering diagrams using it yet but that can only be a matter of time. I've created fonts for microtones and for speaker layout. If you're going to really worry about note spacing, then I'd say that is Sibelius' major failing. It would be nice if you could get to a certain stage and then tell it to treat every single object as a discreet graphical object (rather like you used to be able to do with that Microsoft graphics package embedded into Word) rather than it having to worry about on to what everything was anchored. Most other problems (tuplets across the barlines, different tempi in different parts, 'irrational' time signatures, etc.) are solveable with a little bit of time and effort. The spacing issue is also not insurmountable but is incredibly fiddly. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #109 on: 18:49:53, 12-08-2008 » |
|
It could well be that you might be able to find a font already created for this sort of thing, particularly if you ask around your other composer friends. I had a quick google just now and didn't find anything that would do.
I really don't think it would be too hard to set up TypeTool to create a fingering chart font, but until I get the software back on my computer (after my old one died) I won't be able to experiment. If you let me know when you need it, I might be able to see you right...
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #110 on: 18:55:17, 12-08-2008 » |
|
I'd recommend a font-editor in that case. I use TypeTool from FontLab. Thanks again. I shall add TypeTool to the bill! (and get back to you if I can't make it do what I want) I don't think any of the problems you mention are going to come up. Tuplets across barlines I avoid as far as possible and in orchestral music completely; different tempi in different parts is also not going to happen in this context, and I've only ever used irrational time signatures in two pieces (and in one case all such bars were silent anyway!) as they don't generally fit into my way of doing things. As for spacing, I've heard that's problematic - do you think maybe it would be possible to put somewhere a line consisting only of straight 32nd notes (or whatever the smallest time-value is) and then hide it somehow? |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Ron Dough
|
|
« Reply #111 on: 19:01:22, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Not if you're trying to do what I think you are - you'd be adding extra notes to a bar, and they'd not fit (or at least they'd prevent you from putting your final intended notes into the bar: Sibelius knows how many beans make five).
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #112 on: 19:05:48, 12-08-2008 » |
|
do you think maybe it would be possible to put somewhere a line consisting only of straight 32nd notes (or whatever the smallest time-value is) and then hide it somehow?
Possibly. But I don't think it would really solve the problem. It would still shove them around but at least it would mean that longer durations would be proportionally spaced. You would be able to line everything up by eye by using your method so it might be useful. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #113 on: 19:12:15, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Ron, what I mean is: when I'm writing by hand I almost always use proportional notation - an 8th note for example always occupies say 15mm horizontally, regardless of how busy the music is. This makes it "look right" to me, and given the kind of rhythms which often occur I think it helps performers too. What I've heard about Sibelius is that there's no way of having this automatically happen, so that a 4/8 bar with only one or two notes in it becomes horizontally shorter than one that's packed with them, which is not what I want. So my suggestion (never having looked at the program!) would be to create a dummy melodic line consisting only of rapid repeated notes all of the same very short duration, so that this line "controls" the spacing of all the others, and then when everything else is finished hide this line.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #114 on: 19:20:06, 12-08-2008 » |
|
If only that worked!
I might mock something up later on tonight and then export it as a graphic so that I can post it here.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
Ron Dough
|
|
« Reply #115 on: 19:22:37, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Right, r: I see. No, it can't be done automatically, though you can drag any bar-line or note further along the staff, and that will alter the rest of the parts pro rata for that beat, so if you wanted to be specific about spacing, that should make it possible, though you'd have to work it out by eye - the ruler measurements only work vertically. Any such alteration automatically transfers to the parts - I've just tried it.
[Your post came in the middle of this]
Your ruse should work - let me try that later tonight: smallest available note is a 512th, so you should have plenty of leeway.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #116 on: 19:40:21, 12-08-2008 » |
|
Oh my god. It works.
I'll post the graphic up later, but the key is to use the smallest note value possible (thanks Ron!). It's come out completely evenly.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
Ron Dough
|
|
« Reply #117 on: 19:45:29, 12-08-2008 » |
|
It doesn't necessarily have to be that small, hh: I've just done it with 64ths. I created a single percussion line in an existing score, and filled it up with 64ths: the score went proportional. I then deleted the percussion from the Instrument Creation panel, and the spacing stayed as it was - no need to hide anything.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
richard barrett
|
|
« Reply #118 on: 19:48:33, 12-08-2008 » |
|
It doesn't necessarily have to be that small, hh: I've just done it with 64ths. I created a single percussion line in an existing score, and filled it up with 64ths: the score went proportional. I then deleted the percussion from the Instrument Creation panel, and the spacing stayed as it was - no need to hide anything.
Ha! I think this is the program for me. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
harmonyharmony
|
|
« Reply #119 on: 19:53:05, 12-08-2008 » |
|
I'm inputting bar 657 of the bass clarinet part from Engführung (I) from Opening of the Mouth so it should be a useful test of Barrett-proofness. Deleting the percussion line slightly changed the spacing but not substantially. I haven't investigated how gracenotes will change things yet...
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
'is this all we can do?' anonymous student of the University of Berkeley, California quoted in H. Draper, 'The new student revolt' (New York: Grove Press, 1965) http://www.myspace.com/itensemble |
|
|
|
