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Author Topic: Re: The Cathedral and Church thread  (Read 6312 times)
Don Basilio
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« Reply #300 on: 18:25:08, 26-06-2008 »

Thank you, martle, done.

And here is the medieval font,



the parish teddy bears, and some extremely dodgy wiring underneath the pews.
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Antheil
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« Reply #301 on: 18:27:28, 26-06-2008 »

Don, um, you might want to edit your photos there...   Wink

Is that a Starbucks coffee on the side table  Shocked  Sacrilege!
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #302 on: 18:29:14, 26-06-2008 »

And finally, the exterior from the North:

and from the South

No antheil, the nearest Starbucks is in Oxford, some ten miles away. I suspect that it was from the convent bunfight next door that was the occasion of my visit.
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Antheil
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« Reply #303 on: 18:49:30, 26-06-2008 »

Thank you for those photos Don B. (I can see you have edited but for the life of me don't know what you have changed.)

It is the smell isn't it?  Either redolent of incense or fusty books.  Love it.  I think the dampest smelling Cathedral I ever went to was Chichester, it was when I was a child but I still remember it.

The interior of that Church looked lovely and light, really enjoyed looking at it.

I don't think we will enquire about the bunfight at the Convent, there may be viewers of a Nervous Disposition  Cheesy

Off topic.   One of our local remote village Churches has a tombstone which is now inside the Church to preserve it.  It is for a Church Warden who died 1723.  It is inscribed:

Life is unsartin
and death is shuer
sin is the wound
Christ is the cuer.

Told you we talk funny!

« Last Edit: 20:04:07, 26-06-2008 by Antheil the Termite Lover » Logged

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Don Basilio
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« Reply #304 on: 13:42:00, 28-06-2008 »

Here in N16 is the old parish church of St Mary, Stoke Newington


When the Victorians got Sir George Gilbert Scott to build a new church in 1858, they did not knock down the old church, but built a new one on the opposite side of Stoke Newington Church Street, viz

The spire is a bit later, in fact, but is visible from the main Edinburgh train line out of Kings Cross, behind the new Arsenal Emirates stadium (in fact about a mile away.)

However, St Mary's is celebrating the 150th anniversary of the New Church this June with a whole calendar of events, now mainly past.
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To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under heaven.
A time to weep, and a time to laugh: a time to mourn, and a time to dance
Don Basilio
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« Reply #305 on: 22:12:09, 28-06-2008 »

One of the events was a prayer labyrinth by the New Church, as here


The idea is to walk round the labyrinth meditatively until you reach the centre.  There are no choices to make: it is not a maze.  I can't say I found it a profound experience.  I did turn off Brahms Op 111 on the ipod before walking through it.  Quite calming, and a nice imaginative idea to get people centred in their noisy lives.

Here it is with the old church in the background, on the other side of Stoke Newington Church Street:


And here is a corner, with the side porch of the new church:

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Antheil
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« Reply #306 on: 16:38:15, 29-06-2008 »

So far we have posted about Churches we like or those that are interesting for their architecture.  So now I am posting about something I positively dislike.

I don’t know if anyone here has been to Llandaff Cathedral in Cardiff.  Dedicated to SS Peter and Paul (whose day it is today) and also dedicated to three Welsh Saints, Dyfrig, Teilo and Euddogwy.   St. Teilo built a Church here in 560.  Later there was also a Monastic settlement.  It is one of the oldest Christian sites in Britain and there is a Celtic cross which is over 1400 years old.  Work on the Cathedral commenced in 1120 but wasn’t finished until 1290.  So far well and good and of course over the years there was the usual refurbishment and change. 

This is the reredos of the Lady Chapel which I think is very pretty.



The arch in the distance is the Norman Arch of the original Cathedral begun in 1120



This is an interesting ‘Cadaver’ tomb showing a body in a state of advanced decomposition



In 1941 a German bomb outside fell and it was very badly damaged.  The restoration was carried out by George Pace and Jacob Epstein created the figure of Christ in Majesty which is suspended above the nave on a concrete arch designed by George Pace.

And here it is, what I consider to be a complete monstrosity.  I wonder what others think?


« Last Edit: 17:22:01, 29-06-2008 by Antheil the Termite Lover » Logged

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Don Basilio
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« Reply #307 on: 16:53:13, 29-06-2008 »

Gosh, an (Anglican and either English or Welsh) cathedral I haven't been too.  I would be interested in comments, as well.
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Morticia
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« Reply #308 on: 16:58:40, 29-06-2008 »

My first reaction was 'Oh dear' (uttered quite loudly). It looks as though a spaceship has landed in the Nave Shocked  Nope, don't like.  It jars horribly with the original architecture. Only MHO, of course.
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Antheil
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« Reply #309 on: 17:13:38, 29-06-2008 »

Gosh, an (Anglican and either English or Welsh) cathedral I haven't been too.  I would be interested in comments, as well.

Don B, I had assumed you must have visited there as you have been to St. Woolos Cathedral (of which no-one has ever heard!)

My reaction is the same as Mort.  A space ship has landed and it is totally distracting and totally out of character with the rest of the Cathedral.  There is also a Gabriel Rossetti painting, panels by Burne-Jones and glass by John Piper, lots of interesting effigies and tombs as well.

We have two Cathedrals in Cardiff, following the arrival of a large number of Catholics fleeing famine in Ireland, St David's was built as Cardiff's principal Catholic church in 1887, and it became a cathedral and seat of the Roman Catholic Archbishop of Cardiff in 1916. It also has a Choir School.
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Kittybriton
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« Reply #310 on: 17:32:48, 29-06-2008 »

Is there some structural reason for it being there? it does jar rather with the lines of the rest of the building.
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Don Basilio
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« Reply #311 on: 17:41:09, 29-06-2008 »

I have not been there, but a very good friend whose judgement I trust, and with whom I have spent some happy time church trotting, has seen it and tells me it is OK.

Llandaff is not in the first rank of Gothic cathedrals and the Epstein is certainly impressive and memorable, even if you don't like it.  I imagine it inspired, or was inspired by, Sutherland's tapestry of Christ at Coventry.

And very few cathedrals are all in one pure style.  There is a massive contrast between the styles of the Perp nave and the EE choir at Cantebury, or the Dec body and the OTT Perp of the Henry VII chapel at Westminster Abbey, or the baroque architecture and the late C19 choir mosaics at St Paul's.

I'm not saying that the contrast works at Llandaff, but that there should be different styles side by side is not in itself a bad thing.

There are a number of places where the RC cathedral is head and shoulders better than the Anglican.  Birmingham and Oban to my certain knowledge, Portsmouth possibly.  Liverpool is a bit of a toss up: they are both powerful examples of different approaches.  Maybe Cardiff is another.

(Kitty - no it is decorative, or symbolic.  It takes the place of a medieval rood loft, without blocking the view.)
« Last Edit: 21:18:58, 29-06-2008 by Don Basilio » Logged

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Antheil
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« Reply #312 on: 18:56:14, 29-06-2008 »

Well I agree Don B.  So many Churches and Cathedrals are a mish-mash of styles.  Are there any unadultereated examples?

Don B, If we applied the Sydney Grew scale of ranking then Llandaff would not be the Top Ranking Anglican 'Bach', so to speak, more one of Syd's 'Shoskapobitch' third raters!  Cheesy  I just have to say, it doesn't do it for me that Epstein.  Each to their own though.

What is interesting is that the majority of Welsh Cathedrals have such an ancient foundation.  Not only Llandaff, but Bangor, dedicated to St. Deiniol, was established around c.525,  St. David, patron saint of Wales, founded a 6th century monastery there, St. Woolos. late 470s  the soldier-prince Gwynllyw answered God's call to a life of prayer.  St. Asaph and Brecon Cathedral, (St. John) were Norman foundations.

I think it is the antiquity of these sites and the continued, over the centuries, devotion, that makes one feel humble somehow, that they kept the Faith

St. Asaph is interesting because it houses the William Morgan Bible, the first translation into Welsh of The Bible.  He was  parish priest of Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant  and later Bishop of Llandaff and St. Asaph

In 1563, the London Parliament passed a bill ordering that the Bible be translated into Welsh, an act that was not undertaken with any love or respect for the language, but one that formed "an essential part of the programme of the Protestant Reformation in Britain." Elizabeth and her parliament were appalled at the slow progress of the Welsh people in learning the English language. They thought that by having Welsh translations placed next to the English texts in Church, not only would the congregations learn Protestantism, they would also learn English.

Of course it backfired and the Welsh language was given an unintended status and a place of honor by being used as a medium for the Holy Scriptures. Why would a congregation bother with English, when there was a perfectly acceptable Welsh Bible in which to worship God? (And a book from which one could learn to read and write?)

Sorry, this is turning into a very Welsh posting.

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George Garnett
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« Reply #313 on: 19:58:35, 29-06-2008 »

(Kitty - no it is decorative, or symbolic.  It takes the place of a medieval rood loft, without blocking the view.)

I've just checked my woolly memory and that arch contains a division of organ pipes which you can just see in Anty's picture. I wouldn't like to rule on whether that counts as decorative or structural or on whether it undermines its bid to being a rood screen.

Having had a look at some other photos on the web (I've never been there to see it) the Epstein Majestas itself looks pretty darn'd wonderful to me but I would add my humble opinion to those of others who find the concrete arch thing, by this chap Pace, pretty darn'd 'orrible. 

« Last Edit: 17:06:29, 30-06-2008 by George Garnett » Logged
Antheil
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« Reply #314 on: 20:23:27, 29-06-2008 »

George, the concrete is horrendous!  Dylan Thomas would not have had a fit, of course

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